Balkan politics and EU values | 39 comments (39 topical, editorial, 0 hidden)

I am (none / 1)

going to ignore your borderline ad hominems for now. If you need to know about my nationality, you can look at my profile here at ET or my diaries posted at this forum.

You're still not giving modern numbers. An -absence- of the 8K number is not exactly a verification for your quoted 1500 bodies from an article, which I will repeat, is from 1996.

Your harping and groundless accusations is tiresome because you're dealing with an audience that's more than willing to consider your viewpoint, but not one that beats the same horse over and over again. That gets old real quick. Most, if not all, of the commenters have already expressed their awareness that Serb atrocities did not form the whole pie of the war. Five posts later, we don't need to read it again. And again.

I can't speak for the years prior to Srebrenica, but I'd say we've had Serbian atrocities in the Western limelight for some 10+ years because Serbian forces committed the largest and best known mass-killing on European soil since WWII, no matter how the number game plays out. Doesn't really make Serbs the most popular guy on the field, I'm afraid, and kinda overshadows the other bite-size clips the press machine churns out. It takes slightly more in-depth reading to find out that it wasn't all that black and white.

Again, you've that audience here. Rubbing people's faces in your alternative view at every opportune moment, doesn't really set conditions to sway minds.

by Nomad (Bjinse) on Wed Dec 12th, 2007 at 10:06:15 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I am (none / 1)

You asked for the sources. Here they are. Please don't accuse me of harking.

Jan Willem Honig and Norbert Both - from their book entitled: Srebrenica: Record of a War Crime:

Quote: Oric and his cronies were also responsible for much of the trouble with the Serbs, which stemmed from Muslim raids on Serb communities just outside the enclave. Also, Oric's men had the disconcerting habit of taking up positions close to the Dutch and then opening fire on the Serbs, hoping to entice them and the Dutch into a firefight. (pp. 132-133.)

Two other journalists, Laura Silber and Allan Little, who will never be accused of being sympathetic to the Serbs, note in their book Yugoslavia: Death of a Nation, that

Quote: on January 7, 1993 (the Orthodox Christmas), Oric's forces launched a surprise attack on Serb positions to the north, killing Serb civilians and burning their villages.(pp. 265-266). Serb sources claim Oric massacred as many as 2,500 Serbs on this occasion.

In his report issued on 30 May 1995, the UN Secretary-General had this to say about the Bosnian Government's provocations from the safe areas:

Quote: In recent months, (Bosnian) government forces have considerably increased their military activity in and around most safe areas, and many of them, including Sarajevo, Tuzla and Bihac, have been incorporated into the broader military campaigns of the government side. The headquarters and logistic installations of the Fifth Corps of the government army are located in the town of Bihac and those of the Second Corps in the town of Tuzla. The Government also maintains a substantial number of troops in Srebrenica (in this case, a violation of a demilitarization agreement).

Srebrenica: Manipulating a Tragedy. Project Director: Ed Herman. Chief Participants and Contributors: Ed Herman, Jonathan Rooper, George Bogdanich, Michael Mandel, George Szamuely, Tim Fenton, Philip Hammond. With Foreword by Phillip Corwin

Quote : There can be no equivocation about that. At the same time, the facts presented in this report make a very cogent argument that the figure of 7,000 killed, which is often bandied about in the international community, is an unsupportable exaggeration. The true figure may be closer to 700.

BBC reporter Jonathan Rooper
Quote: the number killed in Srebrenica was most likely in the hundreds, not in the thousands.

On July 14, 2005 edition of Canada's The Globe and Mail, under "The Real Story Behind Srebrenica", General Lewis MacKenzie stated:

Quote: Evidence given at The Hague war crimes tribunal casts serious doubt on the figure of "up to" 8,000 Bosnian Muslims massacred. That figure includes "up to" 5,000 who have been classified as missing. More than 2,000 bodies have been recovered in and around Srebrenica, and they include victims of the three years of intense fighting in the area. The math just doesn't support the scale of 8,000 killed.... It's a distasteful point, but it has to be said that, if you're committing genocide, you don't let the women go since they are key to perpetuating the very group you are trying to eliminate. Many of the men and boys were executed and burried in mass graves.

by vladimir on Wed Dec 12th, 2007 at 11:06:03 AM EST
[ Parent ]

So (4.00 / 2)

You give us the Srebrenica report.

8,106 with the official report here.
>7,800 by Bosnian Serb acknowledgement.
7,079 from the ICRC with still 5,500 missing in 2005. Numbers which probably mean nothing to the likes of Jonathan Rooper.

I weary of this.

by Nomad (Bjinse) on Wed Dec 12th, 2007 at 12:40:50 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: So (none / 0)

And George Bush said that Iraq had weapons of mass destruction. That was official too.

by vladimir on Wed Dec 12th, 2007 at 02:09:08 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Yeah (none / 1)

Those +5,000 people never existed too. QED.

by Nomad (Bjinse) on Wed Dec 12th, 2007 at 02:29:45 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: I am (none / 0)

I apologize for my borderline comment. It was a reaction the remark you made regarding my nationality which I understood as being prejudiced.

by vladimir on Sat Dec 15th, 2007 at 06:10:17 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Balkan politics and EU values | 39 comments (39 topical, 0 editorial, 0 hidden)