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Your last line is entirely free of meaning for me, by the way

Of course it is.

You are therefore also aware, that angels have only ever spun on top of needles in the spin created by people maligning Thomas Aquinas?

However, this is an important question, as to the distinction of the subjective and objective, and while I am prone to pilpul - splitting hairs (Which I prefere to dancing on needles) I really would like to know.
So, all subjectives are contained within the objective? even those that contradict each other? Within an idea, I can understand, but within the "outside" world? Also how is your subjective experience contained in the stone? Also, are all subjectives accessible to everybody, by looking at that stone?

anyway (-: Maybe just point me to a book, ought to go back to work anyway...

by PeWi on Tue Aug 21st, 2007 at 10:20:06 AM EST
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So, all subjectives are contained within the objective? even those that contradict each other?

Absolutely: the subjectives are the models built (at least) by the various physical humans within the physical, objective universe. They're a property of arrangements of matter and energy within that universe.
by Colman (colman at eurotrib.com) on Tue Aug 21st, 2007 at 10:22:50 AM EST
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The subjectives are perceived qualia, and no one has any idea what subjective perception is or where it comes from.

You can make up stories about it - first there are perceptions, then they organise themselves recursively so that the model includes itself - but you're in the world of metaphor, not of real science.

It would be ironic if subjectivity turned out to be metaphysical after all.

But - who knows?

by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Tue Aug 21st, 2007 at 03:23:38 PM EST
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Also, are all subjectives accessible to everybody, by looking at that stone?

the sensations of experiencing the stone are a good starting point for a conversation.

it's hilarious how people sometimes can't agree what colour something is!!

i think the stone wonders about us too...

'The history of public debt is full of irony. It rarely follows our ideas of order and justice.' Thomas Piketty

by melo (melometa4(at)gmail.com) on Tue Aug 21st, 2007 at 08:24:42 PM EST
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