[Updated] Links and thoughts on Société Générale and its traders [with SG's explanation] | 26 comments (26 topical, 0 editorial, 0 hidden)

thoughts on Société Générale and its traders (4.00 / 2)

He's got time to write THE book and I hope he gets no more jail time than everyone! above him.

Our knowledge has surpassed our wisdom. -Charu Saxena.

by metavision on Sat Jan 26th, 2008 at 02:40:12 PM EST

Re: thoughts on Société Générale and its traders (4.00 / 10)

I'm not sure he should get less time than those above him. After all, and if what I have written is true (that is, if Kerviel isn't taking the fall for some other loss), he did go out of his way to falsify his accounts, and hide it from his superiors. I've read somewhere that his direct supervisor was replaced in early 2007, which means the new one wasn't really experimented.

The failure is more that of policy ; SG motivates all of the workers supporting traders by dangling in front of them the possibility of becoming a trader. Those new traders then know the bugs of the system they are not supposed to abuse.

And of course the mythology of the trader, the superman of the All-Powerful Market, is problematic in its own ways. The power these guys wield is astounding ; and for them it is often a game.

Un roi sans divertissement est un homme plein de misères

by linca (antonin POINT lucas AROBASE gmail.com) on Sat Jan 26th, 2008 at 03:24:31 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: thoughts on Société Générale and its traders (4.00 / 2)

Well, I am surprised that there is no absolute separation between overseer and trader jobs, and that you didn't thematised that explicitely.

_{*Lunatic*, n.

One whose delusions are out of fashion.}

by DoDo on Sat Jan 26th, 2008 at 03:42:02 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: thoughts on Société Générale and its traders (4.00 / 2)

The problem is getting people to do the grunt , non prestigious, repetitive, (relatively) low paying overseer job without the hope of making it to the trading floor. Which is why the separation isn't that tight.

Also, there aren't that many people who know all that well the workings of the financial markets, and the computer tools user by the SG (which are mostly done in-house). Taking somebody from the middle or back offices, or support, is cheaper and faster.

Un roi sans divertissement est un homme plein de misères

by linca (antonin POINT lucas AROBASE gmail.com) on Sat Jan 26th, 2008 at 03:50:47 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: thoughts on Société Générale and its traders (4.00 / 4)

No more, no less. By definition, ´responsibility lies with management´ at every level above him for policy, security, legal, systems,... that made it possible and the buck should be passed up, not down.

It would be fab if you get him to join ET: Jerome a prison. His book title: The trillions I saved SG in future losses.

Our knowledge has surpassed our wisdom. -Charu Saxena.

by metavision on Sat Jan 26th, 2008 at 04:54:17 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: thoughts on Société Générale and its traders (4.00 / 7)

It's interesting because it's a universal problem for capitalism. Very often there are workers, on a standard salary, who hold the future of a large portfolio which is many hundreds of times beyond their salary, in their hands.

In these cases, it becomes very apparent that our system is profoundly iniquitous, as the bosses are rewarded for the work of the line workers. It's not a popular view, but my opinion but such conditions breed a certain kind of crime amongst the workers, because it violates human notions of fairness and decency.

by Metatone (metatone [a|t] gmail (dot) com) on Sat Jan 26th, 2008 at 05:21:44 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: thoughts on Société Générale and its traders (4.00 / 3)

many hundreds of times beyond their salary

The estimates on the positions I saw are 50 billion euros. That was five hundred thousand times his salary... (And as a computer programmer, it is demoralising to see those figures passing arounds. Thankfully sometimes one realizes the currency is roubles or yen where eleven figures numbers aren't that huge amounts)

Un roi sans divertissement est un homme plein de misères

by linca (antonin POINT lucas AROBASE gmail.com) on Sat Jan 26th, 2008 at 05:29:33 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: thoughts on Société Générale and its traders (4.00 / 2)

Oh indeed, in this case the figures are truly frightening. I was speaking to the generalised case where things are not so horrifically obviously iniquitous.

by Metatone (metatone [a|t] gmail (dot) com) on Sat Jan 26th, 2008 at 05:31:00 PM EST
[ Parent ]

[Updated] Links and thoughts on Société Générale and its traders [with SG's explanation] | 26 comments (26 topical, 0 editorial, 0 hidden)

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