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Sven Triloqvist:
What is not cool is, as you point out with a large cudgel, interference in what adults can think and do in the comfort of their own homes.

So - how are Jerome's neighbours?

Aside from burning houses down, smoking and alcohol abuse are staggeringly expensive, and they divert health care funds that could be used to keep people alive who are just plain unlucky rather than addicted.

Most domestic violence happens because either or both people are drunk or high. A&E on a Saturday night won't have a lot of sober people visiting.

The financial industry, in all of its addictive insanity, couldn't exist without its coke habits. Nor could advertising.

There's a lot more evidence of mind contraction through substance abuse than mind expansion.

by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Thu Nov 20th, 2008 at 11:56:24 AM EST
[ Parent ]
they divert health care funds that could be used to keep people alive who are just plain unlucky rather than addicted.

That remains to be shown. Smokers and drinkers die young, and old age remains the most expensive disease to treat...

Un roi sans divertissement est un homme plein de misères

by linca (antonin POINT lucas AROBASE gmail.com) on Thu Nov 20th, 2008 at 11:59:23 AM EST
[ Parent ]
And where exactly do chocolate, masturbation, going to the movies and reading books fit into this nice little dystopian universe? ;-)

You can't be me, I'm taken
by Sven Triloqvist on Thu Nov 20th, 2008 at 12:18:11 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Oh, I see - you want all the qualifications to that sweeping statement? Scuzi.

K. Consenting adults PROVIDING they do not expose non-consensuals to risk.

Of course, just being normal has its own risks - like irrelevance.

You can't be me, I'm taken

by Sven Triloqvist on Thu Nov 20th, 2008 at 01:01:21 PM EST
[ Parent ]
So which of alcohol, tobacco, cars and meat don't expose non-consensuals to risk?
by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Thu Nov 20th, 2008 at 03:41:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]
A few things about health costs of addictions:

  1. In particular for smoking my guess is that smokers are actually cheaper for society. We all die, and old people are expensive in treatment during the last bit of their lives, no matter what they die from. But smoking-related diseases often kill people in their sixties, just when they were supposed to enjoy their pensions. A really bad addiction is motorcycles, killing ungrateful young men just when they've been fed and educated for 20 years and before they start working.

  2. I think the argument about cost to society is unfair when you have universal health care paid by taxes. I'm very much in favour of universal health care and don't mind at all paying the necessary taxes. But you can't first force people to pay for something and then use that as an argument to restrict their freedom to do something that only hurts themselves.  


Real capricorns don't believe in astrology.
by tomhuld (thomas punkt huld at jrc punkt it) on Thu Nov 20th, 2008 at 03:19:24 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Technically the UK Treasury makes around £6bn a year in a tobacco taxes, even allowing for the cost of healthcare. So - technically - yes it's a nice little earner for the Treasury.

It's also a tax which falls disproportionately on poor people, who are more likely to spend more of their income on booze and fags.

It's clever that the tobacco and alcohol companies have framed this as a libertarian personal freedom issue.

But it's an odd kind of freedom which is quite so expensive and quite so compulsive.

by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Thu Nov 20th, 2008 at 03:39:44 PM EST
[ Parent ]

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