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Now you may consider these men lefties, but the truth is that JKG was one of the founders of Americans for Democratic Action--a group who sponsored a movement dedicated to combating the extremism of the American Marxists. He wrote for Fortune Magazine and was personally hired by Luce himself. He taught at Harvard for most of his career.
Now in the USA of final days W, such folks could be considered leftists. But by ANY reasonable definition, they are relentless centrists. "Remember the I35W bridge--who needs terrorists when there are Republicans"
You are probably young. But here's a factiod you should never forget. Tricky Dick Nixon was a Keynesian. He believed in wage-price controls. He proposed a minimum income scheme. He gave us regulatory agencies like EPA and OSHA.
I am old enough to remember when Republicans elected to high office were economically FAR to the left of say a Bill Clinton or a Tony Blair. Now YOU may have moved so far to the right that JKG was a "standard issue left wing Democrat" but I certainly have not.
I would also suggest you re-examine some of you economic ideas. Folks who have ideas like yours have horribly mismanaged the economy. We can have $515 trillion in utterly worthless derivatives, but the heavens would fall if we spent $2 trillion per year on projects that are necessary to the survival of humanity? And then you show up on my comment thread to give me cheap lessons on how markets are supposed to work in applications that are, at best, irrelevant, or who the hell is a left-winger.
You seem like a bright guy. If you actually grow up, you might some day have something remotely interesting to say. You are not interesting--I can hear the tripe you spout 24/7 on any number of cable channels. And folks like you have created multiple catastrophes. Perhaps, just perhaps, you guys are just plain wrong!
This will be the last time I debate with you. I have no time for people who think they are clever because they can debate definitions. I thought that shit was boring when I was on the Jr. High debate team. Whether you think JKG was a leftist and I think he was a centrist doesn't change one damn word of what he wrote. But you debate definitions all you want with whomever finds this interesting--I have historical evidence on my side. And on this turf you may be entitled to your own opinions, but not to your own facts.
sheesh "Remember the I35W bridge--who needs terrorists when there are Republicans"
And FWIW I'm pretty damn sure I have a much better idea of at least European policy positions and debates in the fifties, sixties, and seventies than you do (reading every goddamn issue of Spiegel and Die Zeit, plus a random fifth of the FAZ issues from 1945-1975 sort of helps with that. I'm also pretty sure I have a better idea of how the planned economies of Eastern Europe worked - lots of books, and hundreds of thousands of pages of archival documents give me a certain insight). I have far less knowledge of America in that period, but easily enough to know the sort of basic stuff about Nixon's economic policies.
On the other thread for some reason you troll rated me for disputing the idea that regardless of whether the price of diesel is two Euros/l or 20 there would be no difference in the total vehicle miles of freight trucks and for suggesting that labour costs had a good deal to do with the shift of the textile industry to low wage countries.
As for what my ideas are and their impact, I'm not quite sure how the notion that we should have an economic system like Germany in the sixties and seventies - (i.e. a little bit to the left of America in the sixties) led to this disaster. Perhaps you might care to elucidate. Or perhaps not, that's your perogative, just as it is mine to make what comments I wish. It is not your right, however, to troll rate what you disagree with.
Marek, there's no contradiction there. Even Europe has moved so far to the right it's scary. It also means that at least some of the "left wing of left wing" are not as out to lunch as they are made to appear. When the capital development of a country becomes a by-product of the activities of a casino, the job is likely to be ill-done. — John M. Keynes
The post-Reagan consensus was that the working classes - and that includes white collar working classes, who would usually think of themselves as middle class - were only worthy of abuse and contempt.
The two remaining political positions in the US is the far right fuck-em-all position, which glories in the abuse and contempt. And the less far right throw-them-a-bone position which accepts that some strategic concessions may be necessary, as long as they're kept to a minimum.
The idea that workers have an equal place both in democracy and in the economy has been eradicated.
This isn't an arguument about economic theory, but about enlightenment vs aristocracy. The enlightenment view of the inherent equality of all individuals is considered a quaint piece of history by the US political classes, and not a living principle.
So - it's unlikely that policy will change until this point of view is changed. Rational forward planning can't happen as long as there's more interest in abusing and taming the majority of the population than in creating a culture in which it's possible for everyone to flourish.
Perversely, for the aristocrats, destruction of the environment is a valid end in itself, because it's one of the way they can demonstrate their specialness.
Great rant, I reckon.
The discussion is absolutely reminiscent (not surprising bearing in mind the Minnesota background) of how in Norway even the Conservatives are on the "Left".
It's only the Progress party (who get about 20% of the vote and are frozen out by all the other parties) who are identifiably on the Right, and even then only in some of their positions (eg immigration and taxation).
Keep on rockin' techno: you're one of my heroes! "The future is already here -- it's just not very evenly distributed" William Gibson
And then you show up on my comment thread
We can have $515 trillion in utterly worthless derivatives, but the heavens would fall if we spent $2 trillion per year on projects that are necessary to the survival of humanity
I think -- without having given a great deal of thought to the subject ;-) -- the difference is between a Closed and Open analytical/praxiological environment. Derivatives are Closed under CAPM as they 'fall-out' of well understood mathematical constructs¹ developed within a generally accepted intellectual stance². Public spending for the Public Good is Open in that fundamental questions, e.g., what is the Public Good, are uncertain, dependent on the interpreter, and controversial. Another way to look at the difference: Closed allows one to pretend to be 100% objective while Open, by its nature, precludes that pretense.
¹ How congruent these constructs are to Reality is another topic!
² How congruent the generally accepted intellectual stance is to Reality is another topic! ;-) She believed in nothing; only her skepticism kept her from being an atheist. -- Jean-Paul Sartre
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