No One Expects the Spanish Revolution? | 102 comments (102 topical, 0 editorial, 0 hidden)

Re: No One Expects the Spanish Revolution? (4.00 / 2)

At least in Sweden almost no students are registered at the employment office. As students they are not eligible for unemployment benefits anyway, so there is no point. It is not like registering at the employment office gives you a job.

Sweden's finest (and perhaps only) collaborative, leftist e-newspaper Synapze.se

by A swedish kind of death on Sun May 22nd, 2011 at 06:25:00 AM EST
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Re: No One Expects the Spanish Revolution? (none / 0)

The employment office doesn't do part time jobs, then?

"It is not necessary to have hope in order to persevere."

by ARGeezer (ARGeezer a in a circle eurotrib daught com) on Mon May 23rd, 2011 at 10:23:36 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: No One Expects the Spanish Revolution? (4.00 / 5)

The construction of the employment office was set up during the days of full employment, and might have served other purposes then. Since Sweden entered the club of large unemployment policy they largely handle the unemployment, checking that unemployed reaches various checks for unemployment aid (like not studying) and sending unemployed on various courses and programs, content depending on political trends.

The only useful service they provide for a student wanting a part-time job is the employment database, which is online and does not require any registration.

As an anecdote, a friend of mine who had not grasped the system tried to register at the unemployment office despite studying and described a dialogue that went:

You study so you do not qualify for any unemployemnt benefits.
I do not want benefits, I want a job.
Are you going to drop your studies?
No, but I also want a job.
But then you do not qualify for any unemployemnt benefits.

He left unregistered.

Sweden's finest (and perhaps only) collaborative, leftist e-newspaper Synapze.se

by A swedish kind of death on Mon May 23rd, 2011 at 03:04:35 PM EST
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Re: No One Expects the Spanish Revolution? (none / 0)

So there is an x/or function describing students and the employed. How very neo-con. Can't contaminate the sacred statistics. I presume there is no such category as "part time student", for employment purposes.

"It is not necessary to have hope in order to persevere."

by ARGeezer (ARGeezer a in a circle eurotrib daught com) on Mon May 23rd, 2011 at 08:05:10 PM EST
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Re: No One Expects the Spanish Revolution? (4.00 / 3)

No, no.

Employed students are counted as employed, and therefore part of the workforce.

Unemployed students are counted as students, and thus not in the workforce.

Underemployed students are counted as employed (and thus in the work force) for the fraction of their time they are employed and students (and therefore not in the workforce) for the fraction of their time they are not employed.

The net result is to synthetically lower the reported unemployment rate for 16-25 yr-olds, in the same way various retirement programmes synthetically lower the rate for 50+ yr-olds (you are less likely to go into retirement if you have job prospects, so some early retirees would have not retired if there had been jobs available).

- Jake

Friends come and go. Enemies accumulate.

by JakeS (JangoSierra 'at' gmail 'dot' com) on Tue May 24th, 2011 at 06:08:33 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: No One Expects the Spanish Revolution? (none / 1)

This is correct. However, European countries don't appear to apply the same rigorous measurement of student employment. So we have the great differences shown by the chart posted by Melanchthon upthread.

There, Danish under-25 inactivity is cited at less than 30%, which means, not only that a lot of students also have jobs, but that the fact is carefully recorded.

France, otoh, shows the reverse (not in the chart, but the numbers are well-known): around 70% under-25 inactivity - as if no students had a job, which is simply not the case. INSEE says that their Labour Force Survey counts students with jobs in the workforce. Something is going wrong in the recording process?

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Tue May 24th, 2011 at 07:04:41 AM EST
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Re: No One Expects the Spanish Revolution? (none / 0)

There, Danish under-25 inactivity is cited at less than 30%, which means, not only that a lot of students also have jobs, but that the fact is carefully recorded.

The ability to tie all public in- and out-flows of funds (and births, and deaths, and hospitalisations, and crime, and changes of residence) to a particular personal or commercial identification code makes the Danish statistical service scarily accurate.

INSEE says that their Labour Force Survey counts students with jobs in the workforce. Something is going wrong in the recording process?

If they count the same way the Danish statistical service does, a student who works 5 hours a week is recorded as 14 % active. So if all students worked 5 hours a week and 15-20 % of the age group were not students or otherwise outside the labour force, you'd get around 30 % labour force participation rate.

- Jake

Friends come and go. Enemies accumulate.

by JakeS (JangoSierra 'at' gmail 'dot' com) on Tue May 24th, 2011 at 11:19:58 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: No One Expects the Spanish Revolution? (none / 0)

Re France, there are a couple of big ifs there. I've seen no methodology that supports the view that INSEE does such detailed accounting. And, for this to work, all students would have to have a job. Which they don't, just as surely as a good many do.

Re Denmark, wow, I didn't realize it was that efficient.

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Tue May 24th, 2011 at 03:45:01 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: No One Expects the Spanish Revolution? (none / 0)

Has been since the late '60s, when everything was standardised and tied to the central person and business registry. Which also means that Denmark has the longest consistent, high-quality time series in the world for a lot of things. It is no coincidence that we do excellent epidemiology, to take one example.

- Jake

Friends come and go. Enemies accumulate.

by JakeS (JangoSierra 'at' gmail 'dot' com) on Tue May 24th, 2011 at 04:06:06 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: No One Expects the Spanish Revolution? (none / 0)

So is there a category for UNemployed part time students? (Other than SOL?) Is that what I should have specified. :-)

"It is not necessary to have hope in order to persevere."

by ARGeezer (ARGeezer a in a circle eurotrib daught com) on Tue May 24th, 2011 at 09:28:18 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: No One Expects the Spanish Revolution? (none / 1)

The need to develop a government job guarantee programme administered through the employment offices becomes patent.

Also the extent to which current policy is one of preventing full employment.

Economics is politics by other means

by Carrie (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Tue May 24th, 2011 at 06:54:51 AM EST
[ Parent ]

No One Expects the Spanish Revolution? | 102 comments (102 topical, 0 editorial, 0 hidden)

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