Welcome to European Tribune. It's gone a bit quiet around here these days, but it's still going.
Display:
The old left had the problem that its roots were industrial, so there was a tendency to think of "jobs" and "worker participation" in centralised, large-scale, industrial terms.

That was partly the legacy of Marx, for whom the "means of production" were industrial.

There are signs it's starting to ease, and there's a hint of a tendency towards diversification and more free and organic forms of participation.

What's missing on the left at the moment - at least in the UK - is the usual need to move beyond oppositional theatre (e.g. UKUncut) towards demanding seats at the policy table for all issues, not just single-issue campaigns.

That may be starting to happen in Spain. We'll see.

by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Sun May 29th, 2011 at 10:55:08 AM EST
[ Parent ]
That was partly the legacy of Marx Engels, for whom the "means of production" were industrial.

FIFY.

(I'm increasingly convinced that what most Marxians represent as Marx's views are as much an unkind caricature as what most Liberals present Adam Smith's views to be.)

- Jake

Friends come and go. Enemies accumulate.

by JakeS (JangoSierra 'at' gmail 'dot' com) on Sun May 29th, 2011 at 06:52:17 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Kind of. Marx did the abstraction thing, but given the time in which he was writing, he also mentioned "industry" rather a lot.

And when most workers were industrial workers, it's not totally surprising that (say) the Soviets and the Maoists) turned him into a kind of angry patron of worker-deified industrial revolution.

If there's a lacuna in Marx, it's exactly that absence of realistic post-industrial alternatives.

There's not a lot of nature in Marx. There are people, and there are machines and resources, but he knew nothing about eco-systems or symbiotic embedding, so they're not included as original Marxist concepts.

by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Sun May 29th, 2011 at 07:31:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Much of the time what American "liberals" say when they say, "I believe in some of what Adam Smith said, but I also believe in ..." is a better representation of what Smith said in the second half than in the first.

Of course, no free market propaganda mill pays to get large numbers of cheap copies of Theory of Moral Sentiment reprinted.

I've been accused of being a Marxist, yet while Harpo's my favourite, it's Groucho I'm always quoting. Odd, that.

by BruceMcF (agila61 at netscape dot net) on Mon May 30th, 2011 at 12:22:24 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Hell, I'd be satisfied if people would actually read Wealth of Nations, rather than having it on display on their bookshelf to impress their friends (or, even worse, read abridged versions edited by people who have never read anything but abridged versions in the first place...).

- Jake

Friends come and go. Enemies accumulate.

by JakeS (JangoSierra 'at' gmail 'dot' com) on Mon May 30th, 2011 at 12:38:17 PM EST
[ Parent ]
  For a while, The Liberty Press (subsidiary of the Liberty Fund, (not far from a free market propaganda mill, though with some "class" ---now apparently defunct) )  did something reasonably close to that.

   Liberty Press, Indianapolis, 1976 & 1984

  The Theory of Moral Sentiments,  Adam Smith

   isbn:  0865970122

"In such an environment it is not surprising that the ills of technology should seem curable only through the application of more technology..." John W Aldridge

by proximity1 on Mon May 30th, 2011 at 12:48:54 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I have classic full text editions of TMS and WON, both from Liberty Press and at excellent prices. Also works by David Hume. They used to offer scholarships for best essays on libertarian subjects. If they are no longer selling their full text editions of classic works that is a loss.

"It is not necessary to have hope in order to persevere."
by ARGeezer (ARGeezer a in a circle eurotrib daught com) on Mon Jun 13th, 2011 at 12:39:39 AM EST
[ Parent ]
... but few grad schools would require dogmatic history anymore, and, indeed, I believe that where I went would no longer require it after it tipped.

The problem was the number grinding mill attached, where despite 1/2 University appointments, they had full votes in the department.

I've been accused of being a Marxist, yet while Harpo's my favourite, it's Groucho I'm always quoting. Odd, that.

by BruceMcF (agila61 at netscape dot net) on Mon May 30th, 2011 at 12:54:30 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Display:

Occasional Series