"But of course Gintis argument is that this is pious nonsense. That as much as some of us would like coops to be a real alternative to capitalist firms, they seem to not work so often and also to be easily captured by a management group - as the Comrade from Sweden's example makes clear. Perhaps there is no "real left" because we don't actually have a credible alternative to offer and all the angry signifying can't close the gap."

    Oh, of course, that would be Gintis's argument; but it wouldn't be yours, would it?  You'd disagree with Gintis, wouldn't you?  

    It's just that you sound so much like you're a tout for Gintis--especially when you seem to align yourself in "implying" that you subscribe to a view which has it that " as much as some of us would like coops to be a real alternative to capitalist firms, they seem to not work so often and also to be easily captured by a management group - as the Comrade from Sweden's example makes clear. Perhaps there is no "real left" because we don't actually have a credible alternative to offer and all the angry signifying can't close the gap.

   I have a different theory.  There is a "real left," and you are dedicated to its character assassination. By my theory, you consistently employ dishonest techniques which include shilling for dishonest arguments against real left-wing opinion (pretending to mildly criticize them).  You cite as worthy of our time and attention those who declare themselves so, so sorry that "we can't do better than Krugman," and who allow as how it's such a gosh darn shame that co-ops just don't really work.  In fact, co-ops work fine when they're allowed to.  You, however, aren't interested in their having a reputation for effectiveness.  You're dedicated to, in your puny way here, trying to discredit what is an emintently creditable idea.

   You don't approve of Krugman or Stiglitz or Naomi Klein.  They're just not something-or-other enough for you; and yet, they're at once the best of the lot and the best of a heart-breakingly small lot.  There should be more like them and it would help significantly if there were.  But, instead of championing all that is worthy about their work, you denigrate everything about them and meanwhile after damning them with faint praise, you tout the likes of Gintis here, with faint damning.

   As character-references for leftist opinion go, I'd rather take my chances with Rush Limbaugh and Bill O'Reilly than with you.  

  May every passing innocent reader who chances here beware of taking you as an actual advocate of left-wing principles.

   You specialize in diversionary sterile arguments, time-wasting nonsense, fatuous representations of respectable views which are actually worthwhile--as this thread so well shows.  You're a spoiler, pissing in the village well and then complaining about a shortage of potable water.

"In such an environment it is not surprising that the ills of technology should seem curable only through the application of more technology..." John W Aldridge