A shift of sexual mores | 92 comments (92 topical, editorial, 0 hidden)

You yourself alluded to Nuremberg. (none / 0)

That was serious accountability.

Prior to that there are many other examples from that generation. In the US, a number of wall street financiers went to jail and forfeited fortunes (head of NYSE, head of what would become Citibank, et c.). Chamberlain was booted from power for his stupid foreign policy.

Their kid's generation? Not much.

The Hun is always either at your throat or at your feet. Winston Churchill

by r------ on Thu Jun 13th, 2013 at 08:46:28 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: You yourself alluded to Nuremberg. (4.00 / 2)

Umm, no, I didn't. I pointed at the majority of nazi criminals, those that got away. Your claim that this generation of rich&powerful gets away with more criminal behaviour than previous ones is far-fetched and you didn't back it up.

by Katrin on Thu Jun 13th, 2013 at 10:52:31 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: You yourself alluded to Nuremberg. (4.00 / 2)

Not really. We don't know what they're getting away with, by definition because they're - you know - not getting hauled up in court for it.

We do know that UK judges consistently pass down ludicrously lenient sentences on paedophiles and abusers who have establishment links, and that many investigations are actively prevented on establishment orders.

We also know from cases in Europe and the US (e.g. Franklin and Dutroux) there seems to be clear evidence of judicial, political and police protection of sadistic paedophiles.

And we know from the UK that someone like Jimmy Savile can make a career out of abuse, and will be allowed to do so, no matter how many victims complain. (And there were many.)

So - no evidence? Really?

If you're wilfully blind to the facts - or worse, are trying to sweep them under the carpet - you might think that.

But no one familiar with the evidence is going to agree with you.

by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Thu Jun 13th, 2013 at 11:11:30 AM EST
[ Parent ]

And what are you alluding to? (none / 1)

ThatBritGuy:

Not really. We don't know what they're getting away with...

Exactly: we don't know and can't make the comparison Redstar made.

You point at cases where rich and powerful people got lenient sentences. I am not disputing that being rich and powerful helps enormously to get away with crimes. I am disputing that the present generation has better chances to get away than previous ones. And I am disputing that getting away with sexual abuse of children has become easier than in previous generations.

ThatBritGuy:

If you're wilfully blind to the facts - or worse, are trying to sweep them under the carpet - you might think that.

My, what a rhetorical flourish. Am I meant to clap?

ThatBritGuy:

But no one familiar with the evidence is going to agree with you.

If that is so, why don't you supply that evidence?

by Katrin on Thu Jun 13th, 2013 at 01:07:35 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: You yourself alluded to Nuremberg. (4.00 / 7)

Katrin isn't arguing that the present elites gets away with little, she says that they don't get away with more then other generations elites.

I guess if studied (invent some metrics, find sources) the current crop would in comparision probably come in high in getting away with looting their core population, low in getting away with murders against their core population, low in getting away with murders against colonial populations, but high in getting away with destroying the biosphere upon which the civilization rests. Or something like that.

But really, the important thing is that they are getting away with too much. And as long as that holds I don't really think it is all that relevant wheter that is more or less then 19th century politicians or medival barons got away with.

Sweden's finest (and perhaps only) collaborative, leftist e-newspaper Synapze.se

by A swedish kind of death on Thu Jun 13th, 2013 at 01:36:20 PM EST
[ Parent ]

You bought up the Nazis. There were (none / 0)

trials. Not just in Germany, but elsewhere, in the aftermath of the war. People were hung, shamed, jailed, stripped of their companies, stripped of their positions.

Prior to the war, in the United States, a great commission investigating the financial sector resulted in jail sentences as well, not to mention loss of position and stature or confiscatory taxation of the wealthy, with high marginal tax rates continuing until the 1960's.

Nothing like that of any sort is happening today.

The Hun is always either at your throat or at your feet. Winston Churchill

by r------ on Thu Jun 13th, 2013 at 04:24:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]

A shift of sexual mores | 92 comments (92 topical, 0 editorial, 0 hidden)

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