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is a genre of religious literature peculiar to jewish tradition in prophecy. It is not predictive speech. To presume that a prophet's testament (these two authors', for example) is "conditional" is to gainsay the definitive judgment of god regarding the condition (fealty to god) of the people. (Christine Hayes' treatment of the political function of prophets is instructive in this case.)

Psycho-analytic criticism is a genre of literature discredited by scientists who prefer to interpret chemical reactivity as expressing particular autonomic dysfunctions. Certain inferences are then extrapolated to "humanity", as is the custom of many a totalizing regime.

The authors pass over deconstruction methods in the DIY tool kit.

The judgment of their scientific informant, Australian marine biologist Jon Brodie, is "we've failed" to remedy or even prepare for climate change. But "Would I want to live like someone in Papua New Guinea to avoid climate change?" Brodie wonders. "Probably not."

Accordingly, the authors retreat from the brooding "we" to a peculiar image repertoire symbolizing anxiety or trauma --the causes being manifold and irreversible-- which the neurotic alone cannot repair.

In January of this year, a young Gambian man drowned in Venice's Grand Canal, while tourists in their gondolas laughed and filmed him on their phones. This was inhuman, and it suggests that the most immediate collapse of humanity might come from those places that will feel the physical brunt of climate change least directly. In the UK, which is more likely than most countries to escape desertification and mass famine, official and unofficial plans for the future are informed by the idea of a "Lifeboat Britain."

The author's conclusion attempts to reinforce the subliminal message, I need help.

Diversity is the key to economic and political evolution.

by Cat on Sat Sep 9th, 2017 at 01:52:43 PM EST
[ Parent ]
eschatology and milleniarism is a genre of religious literature peculiar to jewish tradition in prophecy.

The Millerites in 17th Century England and the subsequent repetition of the phenomenon would indicate otherwise, but you may be right regarding only religious literature, depending on what is considered 'literature'. I expect that most if not all of these groups used the written word to spread the word of the world's end. Today it is words and speech, much of it on the internet.

"It is not necessary to have hope in order to persevere."
by ARGeezer (ARGeezer a in a circle eurotrib daught com) on Sat Sep 9th, 2017 at 02:36:26 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Millerites

literature

I already linked rationalwiki eschatology, of which millenialism, subsection secular iterations.

Chistine Hayes
here, in particular lectures 15 - 19.

She and Dale Martin are quite the pairing for those who'd rather not get into the weeds of ecumenical "faith" or prefer to climb out of them.

Diversity is the key to economic and political evolution.

by Cat on Sat Sep 9th, 2017 at 03:12:15 PM EST
[ Parent ]
You said: "eschatology and milleniarism
is a genre of religious literature peculiar to jewish tradition in prophecy." I respinded that it is not at all peculiar to the jewish tradition as it has spread to Christianity. I could also have noted the Mayan concept of the Katun, much of which was made leading up to 2012, even if tey used a different number system As you could have said Judeo-Christain Tradition I took it that you did mean 'peculiar to the Jewish tradition.

Now that I think of it, Norse mythology and the 'Twilight of the Gods' Is a similar eschatology, perhaps again not millenerian. According to The Viking Answer Lady Norse speakers did use a base 10 counting system.
http://vikinganswerlady.com/numeric-reckoning.shtml

"It is not necessary to have hope in order to persevere."

by ARGeezer (ARGeezer a in a circle eurotrib daught com) on Sat Sep 9th, 2017 at 09:29:37 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Explain to me what distinction the term "Judeo-Christian tradition" obtains apart from "jewish tradition in prophecy" narrated in the OT and NT.

Besides calling out the psychiatrists to which the authors refer, I took on the subject to assign that prophetic role to the authors in this eschatological, calamitous, era which they identify with climate change and inhumanity, degradation, incontinence, alienation, &tc. Were you able to listen to the Hayes and Martin lectures (You may find transcript @ Yale; some do along with syllabus), you would apprehend the relevance of that function in that tradition is not predictive power.

What happened to prophet Isiah, prophet Jesus, prophet Luther (HAPPY BIRTHDAY!), prophet Miller? Nevermind.

Consider the relevance of pagan or gentile prophetic traditions to the authors' despair amid "human futilitarianism".

I visited VikingLady years ago, looked around, and haven't been back. It was difficult to avoid as there are few more authoritative references on "humanity" (and wiccan ritual and recipes) beside Smedley Butler and Robert Altmeyer.  

And The Bible.

Little Known Fact: an UID, also a film buff, responded to a comment I posted about The 13th Warrior --much in the way I recommended Last Kingdom to you. You know that story: Muslim ambassador meets crude Vikings in thrall of superstition, dispels mystery. walp, VikingLady keeps an excerpt of ibn whathefu's memoir. That encounter with Rus was reported to be the literary basis of the film plot. Of course, I went in search of the translator and complete text, because that's what I do.

Diversity is the key to economic and political evolution.

by Cat on Sun Sep 10th, 2017 at 01:31:44 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I very much enjoyed The 13th Warrior. It fit well what I understood about both the Viking world and Dar al Islam.

"It is not necessary to have hope in order to persevere."
by ARGeezer (ARGeezer a in a circle eurotrib daught com) on Mon Sep 11th, 2017 at 02:03:57 AM EST
[ Parent ]
by chance another secondary source
< wipes tears >
Alfred of Wessex (Las Kingdom makes a cameo appearance

Diversity is the key to economic and political evolution.
by Cat on Sat Sep 16th, 2017 at 07:16:55 AM EST
[ Parent ]
From runestones it's pretty clear that the Vikings used a predominantly ten-based system, but without symbols for numbers other than abbreviations. So I think the Viking lady is right on that one.

Not using symbols for numbers, I don't think there was millennialism as such as in the magic of big, round numbers. Or at least I haven't heard of it.

The Twilight of the Gods on Norse mythology is interesting because it becomes less clear the more one studies it. Has it happened? Is it going to happen? An interpretation I have come across is that what we see is a mix of a cyclic myth with death and re-birth of the world colored by the three year winter 536-539 AD as Fimbulwinter and interpreted through and adopted to a Christian world by Snorre. That could explain the variations and unclear time frame.

by fjallstrom on Mon Sep 11th, 2017 at 03:15:20 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Am I to understand, Millerite eschatology and religious dogma does not rely on bible literature?

Diversity is the key to economic and political evolution.
by Cat on Sat Sep 9th, 2017 at 03:20:56 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Certainly not. I was responding to your 'peculiar' qualifier and have so noted above.

"It is not necessary to have hope in order to persevere."
by ARGeezer (ARGeezer a in a circle eurotrib daught com) on Mon Sep 11th, 2017 at 02:10:47 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Jewish eschatology may have been born of a Babylonian environmental overshot, or several ancient overshots in the "fertile crescent". And yeah, Babylonian liberals with middle class humanitarian sensibilities were sitting ducks of that "apocalyptic" selection event:

The world's Holy Books - the Old and New Testaments, the Ko­ran, religious literature from the Middle Ages to this day - echo this voice of rebellion, combining contempt for the corrupt urban life, sus­picion of the merchant, and often, intense misogyny.
by das monde on Sun Sep 10th, 2017 at 04:13:44 AM EST
[ Parent ]
This is motif that Bernal investigates in the three volumes of Black Athena. The first volume cause the most status quo ruckus, because Bernal tackles systematic "afro-asiatic" censorship. His project, first published 1987 by Rutgers, encouraged a vanguard of "multicultural" scholars like Hayes and Martin (above) or Graeber, who attained notoriety when he was dismissed from Yale for "wandering off the reservation".

Vagaries of Fashion: Abrahamic Faiths and Law

Bernal laid out as never before the historicizing, totalizing authority of european scholarship --especially among "classicists" who rejected "Ancient Model" historiography in order to define "Aryan" models of world history, humanity, civilization, and valid scientific, or empirical, "positivism" serving concomitant polemic serving divine and darwinian hierarchy of "races". Bernal does this by cross-examining three centuries of canonical literature and tuition sponsored by "gatekeepers" anchored to "Greek civilization". The other two volumes employ historical linguistic technique to translate archaeological materials and critique ethnographic syllabaries, cognates, and 'industry' persisting to this day. Now, note: Bernal's investigation does not reject out of hand all prior art. That's not his purpose; It is to restore "multicultural" material and authority to the body of knowledge of "humanity" which should be available to students.

Panic
The authors of this curiously titled essay "Tropical Depression" posit the ethical crisis, Who is disturbed by all manner of crises which "climate change" represents?
That depends, I suppose, on who has the time to investigate the "special case" --the parable-- of Pateh Sabally

Diversity is the key to economic and political evolution.

by Cat on Sun Sep 10th, 2017 at 01:44:53 PM EST
[ Parent ]
"Arthur Wyns is a tropical biologist passionate about biodiversity and climate change action." This may explain in part his motive to promote Climate-KIC.

One group will be traveling from the fruit-orchards in Bologna, Italy, to a business innovation hub in Munich, Germany, and finally to Helsinki, Finland, where they will pitch the project they have developed during the course of their journey to a jury of entrepreneurs and businessmen.

The six other groups that are being guided through Europe undergo a similar process, travelling from city to city and cultivating an out-of-the-box idea into a concrete business-plan.

where cultivating tropical biodiversity has been quite successful.

Diversity is the key to economic and political evolution.

by Cat on Thu Sep 14th, 2017 at 04:15:02 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Did Bernal, Hayes (or anyone) related eschatology and historical ecology directly? If you have references, please email me.

The ancient Greece and Rome were organic progenies of the civilization centers round Asia Minor. They were the New Worlds across a sea or two, somewhat deviant in their intellectualism or organized militarism.

Apart from them, Europe was a backwater of the most active trade routes and cultural exchange up until the 16th century. With Portugal and Spain the most desperate back ends. But the military experiences in the Mediterranean provided Europe with a huge naval edge.

by das monde on Fri Sep 22nd, 2017 at 01:52:33 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Yes.

Read Bernal's book, vol 1 - III, especially II-II, because those examine semitic languages' documentary and archeological artifacts relating Near East (a/k/a ocident, asia-minor/anatolia) and Egyptian "traditions" (myth cycles, cults, migration patterns) 3rd - 1st centuries BCE. Historical linguistic analysis gets quite technical with phonological and orthographic notations. For readers like me who are untutored in the "discipline" of translating dead languages, it's been a de-mystifying wonder puzzle. You simply have to acquire copies of the books. Totl bibliograhy ~ 600pp. I'm sorry.

I linked Hayes' intro to old testament youtube lectures (espec. 15-19, classic and literary prophets)here. You'll have to listen to them actually, hear the word and application of "eschatology" for yourself. Dale Martin's intro to NT, too.

Diversity is the key to economic and political evolution.

by Cat on Fri Sep 22nd, 2017 at 03:15:56 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Dale Martin's very first lecture offers his students a powerful "frame" for examining so-called sacred literature.

30 years ago I had was Bernal.

:: incidentally
I quite like the radically concise "syllabary" for reading classical T/Dao philosophy: yin, yang, not only because I've been cultivating my daughter's instruction in Mandarin for a decade.

Diversity is the key to economic and political evolution.

by Cat on Fri Sep 22nd, 2017 at 04:48:40 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Thank you! I started watching.

Taoism underscores the complementary harmony of yin and yang, while their particular duality is emphasized by Confusianism.

by das monde on Sat Sep 23rd, 2017 at 01:35:32 PM EST
[ Parent ]
yes, and Lao Tzu et seq.

Diversity is the key to economic and political evolution.
by Cat on Sat Sep 23rd, 2017 at 07:31:29 PM EST
[ Parent ]
"Accordingly, the authors retreat from the brooding "we" to a peculiar image repertoire symbolizing anxiety or trauma --the causes being manifold and irreversible-- which the neurotic alone cannot repair."

I categorically reject this response and embrace optimism as a choice. I belived the current climate challenge can be substantially met, even as I acknowledge the improbability of so doing. I cannot and will not reject my own mortality, the mortality of the civilization into which I was born or the possibility of the extinction of the human species. I have long maintained that one cannot live life while denying death and extending that position to include the death of my culture and species seems natural and logical to me.

The psychoanalyst turned historian Ele Sagan in 'The Honey and the Hemlock - Democracy and Paranoia in Ancient Greece and Modern America' notes that the real miracle is that, given the many psychological debilities of human beings, we have managed to survive this long in societies this complex. If we cannot save ourselves when it is quite possible to do so we do not deserve to survive - IMO.

"It is not necessary to have hope in order to persevere."

by ARGeezer (ARGeezer a in a circle eurotrib daught com) on Mon Sep 11th, 2017 at 02:32:54 AM EST
[ Parent ]
If we have a chance to survive, and we try it, we might survive.

If we have a chance to survive, and we don't try it, we won't survive. Or at least it's likely to depress the chance.

Embracing optimism, it's the logical choice.

by fjallstrom on Mon Sep 11th, 2017 at 03:42:25 PM EST
[ Parent ]
"Accordingly, the authors retreat from the brooding "we" to a peculiar image repertoire symbolizing anxiety or trauma --the causes being manifold and irreversible-- which the neurotic alone cannot repair."

I categorically reject this response and embrace optimism as a choice. I belived the current climate challenge can be substantially met, even as I acknowledge the improbability of so doing. I cannot and will not reject my own mortality, the mortality of the civilization into which I was born or the possibility of the extinction of the human species. I have long maintained that one cannot live life while denying death and extending that position to include the death of my culture and species seems natural and logical to me.

The psychoanalyst turned historian Ele Sagan in 'The Honey and the Hemlock - Democracy and Paranoia in Ancient Greece and Modern America' notes that the real miracle is that, given the many psychological debilities of human beings, we have managed to survive this long in societies this complex. If we cannot save ourselves when it is quite possible to do so we do not deserve to survive - IMO.

"It is not necessary to have hope in order to persevere."

by ARGeezer (ARGeezer a in a circle eurotrib daught com) on Mon Sep 11th, 2017 at 02:34:33 AM EST
[ Parent ]
No Gas in Florida: Give Truth a Chance
...One of the first things that struck me about Cuba was that they take seriously the task Davis dismisses: how to know what it means to be human. When I mentioned this in academic presentations, I got jeered. In retrospect, I don't think I was understood. How could I be? ...


Diversity is the key to economic and political evolution.
by Cat on Thu Sep 14th, 2017 at 12:39:51 PM EST
[ Parent ]
This is an excellent article with which I almost entirely agree. And I fully agree with what I read of Wade Davis' views on 'being human'.

What sprang immediately to my mind upon reading this article in the context of our ongoing conversation was Ernst Becker's The Denial of Death. (Full length PDF) Following is an excerpt from the foreword by Sam Keen:

In the years since his death, Becker has been widely recognized as one of the great spiritual cartographers of our age and a wise physician of the soul. Gradually, reluctantly, we are beginning to acknowledge that the bitter medicine he prescribes -- contemplation of the horror of our inevitable death -- is, paradoxically, the tincture that adds sweetness to mortality.

Becker's philosophy as it emerges in Denial of Death and Escape from Evil is a braid woven from four strands.

The first strand. The world is terrifying. To say the least, Becker's account of nature has little in common with Walt Disney. Mother Nature is a brutal bitch, red in tooth and claw, who destroys what she creates. We live, he says, in a creation in which the routine activity for organisms is "tearing others apart with teeth of all types -- biting, grinding flesh, plant stalks, bones between molars, pushing the pulp greedily down the gullet with delight, incorporating its essence into one's own organization, and then excreting with foul stench and gasses the residue."

The second strand. The basic motivation for human behavior is our biological need to control our basic anxiety, to deny the terror of death. Human beings are naturally anxious because we are ultimately helpless and abandoned in a world where we are fated to die. "This is the terror: to have emerged from nothing, to have a name, consciousness of self, deep inner feelings, an excruciating inner yearning for life and self-expression -- and with all this yet to die."

Elizabeth Kubler-Ross and Ernest Becker were strange allies in fomenting the cultural revolution that brought death and dying out of the closet. At the same  time that Kubler-Ross gave us permission to practice the art of dying gracefully, Becker taught us that awe, fear, and ontological anxiety were natural accompaniments to our contemplation of the fact of death.

The third strand. Since the terror of death is so overwhelming we conspire to keep it unconscious. "The vital lie of character" is the first line of defense that protects us from the painful awareness of our helplessness. Every child borrows power from adults and creates a personality by introjecting the qualities of the godlike being. If I am like my all-powerful father I will not die. So long as we stay obediently within the defense mechanisms of our personality, what Wilhelm  Reich called "character armor" we feel safe and are able to pretend that the world is manageable. But the price we pay is high. We repress our bodies to purchase a soul that time cannot destroy; we sacrifice pleasure to buy immortality; we encapsulate ourselves to avoid death. And life escapes us while we huddle within the
defended fortress of character.

Society provides the second line of defense against our natural impotence by creating a hero system that allows us to believe that we transcend death by participating in something of lasting worth. We achieve ersatz immortality by sacrificing ourselves to conquer an empire, to build a temple, to write a book, to establish a family, to accumulate a fortune, to further progress and prosperity, to create an information-society and global free market. Since the main task of human life is to become heroic and transcend death, every culture must provide its members with an intricate symbolic system that is covertly religious. This means that ideological conflicts between cultures are essentially battles between immortality projects, holy wars.

One of Becker's lasting contributions to social psychology has been to help us understand that corporations and nations may be driven by unconscious motives that have little to do with their stated goals. Making a killing in business or on the battlefield frequently has less to do with economic need or political reality than with the need for assuring ourselves that we have achieved something of lasting worth.


Forty years on I might now have to re-read and finish that book.

"It is not necessary to have hope in order to persevere."
by ARGeezer (ARGeezer a in a circle eurotrib daught com) on Thu Sep 14th, 2017 at 02:30:46 PM EST
[ Parent ]
That may be a constructive activity, if your goal is understanding why you stopped reading it.

I've been rereading books in my stacks for decades. One's perspective or attitude toward the world, "the context," changes -- in my case anyway.

Diversity is the key to economic and political evolution.

by Cat on Thu Sep 14th, 2017 at 04:07:47 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Same here. I got far enough into it to validate beliefs I had independently formed, but I had only limited time for such reading in those days, with work, family, etc.

"It is not necessary to have hope in order to persevere."
by ARGeezer (ARGeezer a in a circle eurotrib daught com) on Thu Sep 14th, 2017 at 04:17:56 PM EST
[ Parent ]

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