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The issue is quite complicated.

I'll try to bullet point it the various strands I see but I'm quite sure that Frank or Colman would conjure an entrely different list.

The conervative party have a considerable investment in Ulster remaining as an integral part of the United Kingdom. To them, letting it become even semi-detached woould be akin to losing an arm voluntarily.

The majority population of Ulster wish to remain as an integral part of the UK. We can discuss colonial politics as much as you like but those guys are Irish and staying there.

Due to the long standing air and ship building establishments in Ulster (now shut down) there have been strong links between par-military units in Ulster and the security services to protect Ulster's status wthin the UK. This is a very powerful voice to preserve the status quo within Westminster that cannot be ignored.

These same people are utterly opposed to any concept of becoming part of the Republic. The DUP's hatred of the EU is founded in part on the view that membership of the EU would gradually eradicate the difference between Ulster and the Republic.

Many in the Republic are very happy with their country and its independence from the UK. They would be generally hostile to the idea that Ulster Protestants unwillingly brouht into the Republic and generally acting more as agent's of the UK undermining the Republic rather than as fully committed Irish people working towards a better Europe.

Most of these are emotional and blood links of dependency and trust, and of emnity and distrust that are generations deep. Logic, law and political convenience mean nothing in this context.

keep to the Fen Causeway

by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Sun Feb 11th, 2018 at 10:29:21 PM EST
[ Parent ]
parts not specified under examination.
Varadkar and May at Stormont for power-sharing talks 12 Feb

Change is going to come.

Ulster Unionist Party

Our vision is of Northern Ireland as the UK's Gateway to the EU
[...]
Northern Ireland due to receive almost €3.4 billion over the current EU budget period 2014-2020, with additional funds expected from centrally managed EU programmes. There is now a fear that this funding could be in jeopardy

because even an asshole knows who not to bite. So.
If you were Barnier-Varadkar-May combined, which gov will be 'patroling' the invisible customs border?

Diversity is the key to economic and political evolution.

by Cat on Mon Feb 12th, 2018 at 04:44:12 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Guardian - Polly Toynbee - The roadblock hard Brexiteers can't drive around: Ireland

But there is one great question: Ireland. The Brexiteers avoid mentioning it, because Ireland is their roadblock. The border is marked by memories of British bad faith that have been gradually healing over 20 years of peace. What a strange irony if Ireland ends up saving us all from ourselves. The border conundrum can only be resolved by forcing May to abandon her contradictory red lines - no customs union, no single market, no European court of justice - and no hard border.
[....]
The shadow Brexit secretary, Keir Starmer, says: "No one has explained how the border commitments can be kept unless a customs union with the EU is on the negotiating table and the final deal delivers the benefits of the single market." Never mind the finessed language, watch that turn into a resounding Labour vote when the crunch comes, as Anna Soubry and Ken Clarke rally Tory rebels.

May dares not see off her ultra wing, but parliament looks set to do it for her. The anvil on which a soft Brexit is forged will be Ireland, because there is no other option. Despite history, it stands to be the United Kingdom's saviour.

I'm not sure I share Toynbee's certainty, I still think there is a chance of the brexiteers having "one last heave" and May deciding that it is more important to deliver brexit to the donors who matter (aka Murdoch and the Mail) than retaining the idea of the UK as a nation of treaties and laws. After all, becoming a libertarian dergulated tax haven is a lot easier if your country has demonstrated itself as above international law

keep to the Fen Causeway

by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Mon Feb 12th, 2018 at 06:28:26 PM EST
[ Parent ]
The EU side is actually drawing a line (or calling the UK's vague statements, your choice):

EU issues Brexit ultimatum on Ireland - Politico

The EU will prepare a draft of the U.K. withdrawal treaty that envisions Northern Ireland remaining in the customs union -- essentially issuing an ultimatum that London come up with other options or accept that there is no other practical way to avoid the recreation of a border between Ireland and Northern Ireland, the EU's chief negotiator, Michel Barnier, said Friday.

Speaking at a news conference alone, rather than alongside his U.K. counterpart, David Davis, Barnier insisted that the EU has no choice but to begin drafting such legal language because London has offered no clarity on how the Ireland-Brexit conundrum might be solved as part of an overall new relationship.

"It's important to tell the truth," Barnier said, suggesting that British officials have not been forthright about the implications of their public pronouncements. "A U.K. decision to leave the single market and leave the customs union would make border checks unavoidable."

by Bernard on Mon Feb 12th, 2018 at 07:33:07 PM EST
[ Parent ]
That was quick.
Varadkar and May say there is now a basis for a deal to reinstate power-sharing
Mrs May said the meetings with the five chieftains at Stormont had been "full and frank".
[...]
cultural matters to be embraced in three separate bills ... same sex legislation [TABLED] ... Arlene Foster must step aside [TABLED] ...  Historical Investigations Unit to inquire into Troubles-related killing and a separate Independent Commission on Information Retrieval
[...]
If the deal is confirmed this week it could take towards the end of the month before the Executive and Assembly are reinstated as legislation to restore Stormont first must be passed at Westminster [!] which is in recess until Tuesday week, February 20th.

Alrighty then. Everything homey but ...
May says there is 'basis for an agreement' at Stormont
a comprehensive free-trade and customs arrangement involving Britain and Ireland, and said both governments have an agreement to work together at a sufficient level to explore how that can be achieved over the coming weeks and months.

The progress of parties concerned is conditional on good behavior amirite.

Diversity is the key to economic and political evolution.

by Cat on Mon Feb 12th, 2018 at 08:35:36 PM EST
[ Parent ]
too little too late. I believe Barnier has just rendered the DUP's involvement in this process obslolete

keep to the Fen Causeway
by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Mon Feb 12th, 2018 at 08:55:11 PM EST
[ Parent ]
DUP is no concern of EU.

DUP is no concern of Tory gov. I said that last November after the Withdrawal/Repeal passing. DUP is replaceable.

NI gov requires domestication as does Tory gov. I shouldn't be surprised if Arlene keeps a Unionist, seven kinds of automatic rifle, ordinance and ammo under her bed. I shouldn't be surprised if the EU27 expects Davis to lie about his mother. The first step then for any "Irish" remainers and their craven Tory allies is to demo creditable "North-South-East-West" cooperation for EU dispensation.

Basic carrot.

You didn't answer my question: Who will be the likely invisible border patrol?

Diversity is the key to economic and political evolution.

by Cat on Mon Feb 12th, 2018 at 10:04:04 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Here's how Independent.co.uk "front page" headlines cover Stormont meeting of the five tribes last week.

Northern Ireland talks latest: How did power-sharing at Stormont collapse and what would a new DUP-Sinn Fein deal look like?

Theresa May's visit to Northern Ireland described as `distraction' by Arlene Foster

because misery loves company, no?

Diversity is the key to economic and political evolution.

by Cat on Wed Feb 14th, 2018 at 01:11:07 AM EST
[ Parent ]
A very complicated matter: Pretty sure I've seen this act a few times before.
DUP will not sign off on stand-alone Irish Language Act
In an interview with the Press Association, the DUP leader again insisted her party would not sign off on the stand-alone act - a key Sinn Féin demand throughout the 13-month impasse. She also ruled out any laws that would require bilingual [!!] road signs in Northern Ireland; compulsory teaching of Irish [!!!] in schools; or quotas [!*&!$!!] of Irish language speakers within the civil service.
[...]
"I am the leader of the Democratic Unionist Party so therefore I will be the person that's put forward by the party to be first minister," she said.

Famous last words.

Diversity is the key to economic and political evolution.

by Cat on Wed Feb 14th, 2018 at 01:39:34 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I knew I'd seen that act somewhere before!
School-Segregation Effort in Alabama Reversed at 11th Circuit

So. Who rules Northern Ireland?

Diversity is the key to economic and political evolution.

by Cat on Thu Feb 15th, 2018 at 08:36:29 PM EST
[ Parent ]



Diversity is the key to economic and political evolution.
by Cat on Thu Feb 15th, 2018 at 10:39:27 PM EST
[ Parent ]

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