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The French figures look bad at the moment because they are retrospectively adding in nursing home deaths much later than when they actually occurred.

As far as I know the UK figures still only include hospital deaths which means their situation is much worse than it appears from the figures.

So when will both countries include deaths in the community, and to what extent are deaths being excluded because no test was ever performed?

I think it will be some time before we get accurate counts for most countries, and then only by inference from a much higher than usual total death count in the population.

Already I see quite a few right wing commentators saying its only people in the 70+ age range who are dying, and they would have died sooner rather than later in any case.

Some are arguing that the shut down is crazy because people die in huge numbers all the time, and this is only a bump on that road. It's almost as if they regard this as a necessary cull of expensive to maintain and unproductive elderly people.

Index of Frank's Diaries

by Frank Schnittger (mail Frankschnittger at hot male dotty communists) on Thu Apr 9th, 2020 at 08:16:15 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Numbers for April 10 in France:

Deaths in hospital:  8,598 (+554 in the last 24 hours)

Deaths in nursing homes: 4,599 since March 1st (+433 in the last 24 hours)

Total deaths since the outbreak: 13,197

7,004 patients in ICU nationwide, the second day in a row that this figure is decreasing, which might be a sign, if a faint one, that the pressure on the health care system is slowly starting to ease.

The number of cases and ICU patients is much lower than the national average in the regions on the Atlantic seaboard, from Brittany to the Basque country. This prompted again a transfer of 48 ICU patients from the Paris region to the southwest towns of Bordeaux, La Rochelle, Poitiers etc.. using the famous "high-speed hospitals", TGV high-speed trains repurposed into high capacity ambulances.

Meanwhile in the UK:

Deaths in hospital: 8,958 (+980 in the last 24 hours)
No figures for care homes.

by Bernard on Fri Apr 10th, 2020 at 08:37:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]
From my diary - Healthiest Generation Under Attack

Beyond the official RIVM death count, the real numbers more than doubles this false representation. Not causing fear... or saving a$$. Rutte & Co.

Mortality in NL Continuous to Rise | NL Times |

My earlier post ...

Lying Liars: Rutte, BoJo, Trump

by Oui on Fri Apr 10th, 2020 at 08:53:39 PM EST
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In Ireland 54% of all deaths are in care homes, median age 80+, so we can only conclude that the real UK figures are at least double the official hospital death count, and even then only include those confirmed by a test to have died from the Corona Virus. It is a national scandal that they still continue with this undercount as the official figure. Don't people dying in nursing homes count for anything?

Index of Frank's Diaries
by Frank Schnittger (mail Frankschnittger at hot male dotty communists) on Fri Apr 10th, 2020 at 11:45:04 PM EST
[ Parent ]
For many years now a generational separation and conflict has been brewing ... with austerity measures after the financial crisis and the large inequality causing real income for the masses to fall behind. Politicians and even in tv commercials there was an underlying message of blame and envy of the older generation who were better positioned in pensions and sometimes in welfare from the state.

This I found to be emblematic, a letter to a Dutch newspaper in the hard hit South of Holland recently .... it loosened many tongues.

"Houdoe Mien, I'll be there shortly": the loss of hundreds of grandpas and grandmas | AD.nl |

    Opinion: Jacqueline Klaassen from Etten-Leur sent us a letter in response to the article about the couple Mien and Henk Van Lith who died from the consequences of the corona virus. Her letter sparked a storm of reactions. Ranging from indignation to readers who agree with her. We have collected all letters from the past week.

    Jacqueline's letter

    Children are more important
    "Goodbye Dad, Goodbye Mom, Goodbye Granddad, Goodbye Grandma."  Nice story though. But shall we stop pretending this is a terrible drama? Actually nice, isn't it? If you may go together at that age, after a relatively short illness? Rather write about all those children who are currently lagging behind in school, who are in potentially dangerous home situations, who are not getting enough exercise. About all people who cannot be treated in hospitals now. Or entrepreneurs who break down. I am very concerned. The remedy is many times worse than the disease. What if we don't build resistance to the possibly much worse second wave by sitting inside? What if that wave does hit our children? The schools are only closed due to social pressure. Where is the much needed counterweight? We sacrifice the future of our children for a large group that barely had a future.

* Houdoe is a local expression - meaning from Wikipedia.

Trump: 'We Can't Have the Cure Be Worse Than the Problem'
The Longhorn State - Bigger Than Trump's New York

Of course in The Netherlands the numbers of lives lost add up into the thousands, elderly dying in anguish with no medical staff like St. Thomas in London. St. Thomas the doubter. The grandmas and grandpas dying in loneliness, separated from their loved ones.

by Oui on Sat Apr 11th, 2020 at 03:12:54 AM EST
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by Oui on Sat Apr 11th, 2020 at 08:07:59 AM EST
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I am conflicted on this issue. In the 1960's and 1970's we had the counter culture which cast the younger generation against their parents. It was driven my resentment against the austerity of the 1950's, the Vietnam war, racism, civil rights, anti-Apartheid, anti-militarism and led to pacifism, flower power, recreational drugs and a cultural explosion in pop and rock music and many other art forms.

On the whole it was a very positive experience, but it also led to familial splits, estrangements, a social distancing were some parents/older people were identified with the enemy. They has come through an entirely different set of experiences - the Great depression, WWII, the holocaust, rationing - which had shaped their generation in a very different way.

I don't sense as much of an inter-generational divide this time around. There may be the occasional raves and youth protest parties like Podemos, but no international counter-culture like the last time around.  And this is despite this being possibly the first generation, in a long while, which may be poorer than their parents.

I'm not even sure about that latter point. Certainly inequality has been rising, encouraged by neo-liberal globalisation, privatisation and austerity, and most wealth is in the hands of the elderly. But younger people now take for granted what we couldn't even dream of - their own cars, smart phones, the internet, home entertainment systems and eating/drinking out regularly in a wide variety of cuisines when the chip shop was the height of our aspirations or affordability and a cheap Chinese meal was the height of exotica.

But overall I am driven my a sense that inter-generational relationships are better than they used to be, with older people more prepared to adapt, and younger people more prepared to make allowances. Maybe I am just very fortunate in that regard and the dominant experiences in other societies may be different.

Certainly I am struck by what seems to be a fracturing, atomisation, alienation, commodification, and distancing of relationships particularly in the USA, and perhaps being nationalist movements in Europe - to a degree even technology can't ameliorate. Trump seems to me to be leading a protest of the privileged and ageing against the diminution of their powers.

But I'm not sure. Your views are welcome...

Index of Frank's Diaries

by Frank Schnittger (mail Frankschnittger at hot male dotty communists) on Sat Apr 11th, 2020 at 08:36:36 AM EST
[ Parent ]
"Trump seems to me to be leading a protest  ..."

I will reply in full in a bit, but this really stung me.

Trump is not leading in anything, but was carried into the presidency and White House by a group op billionairs especially Robert Mercer with Steve Bannon, Breitbarth, SLC Group from UK, subsidiary Cambridge Analytics and Zuckerberg's Facebook. Trump is a AAA Class puppet of his masters. Do think of influence Adelson, Jared Kushner and the Jewish Nation led by Netanyahu.

by Oui on Sat Apr 11th, 2020 at 11:00:06 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Numbers for April 11 in France:

Deaths in hospital:  8,951 (+353 in the last 24 hours)

Deaths in nursing homes: 4,889 since March 1st (+290 in the last 24 hours)

Total deaths (hospitals + nursing homes) since the outbreak: 13,840

6,883 patients in ICU nationwide (7004 yesterday), still decreasing for the third day in a row. "Flattening the curve" actually means that the "peak" is looking more like a plateau ("a high plateau" said a Health Ministry official).

In the UK:

Deaths in hospital: 9,875 (+917 in the last 24 hours)
No figures for care homes.

by Bernard on Sat Apr 11th, 2020 at 08:34:21 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Yes, Trumpian ideas have reached the Dutch community and the National press is helping by broadcasting the idiotic speeches of Trump at the White House while downdressing the independent reporters. "You asked a nasty question ... you are from the Fake media, I win't give you an answer."

Translation: "The dry wood is cut down, perhaps a few months earlier than without a virus. Does anyone still in the prime of life have to sacrifice everything for that?"

As I commented earlier ... there is a strong undercurrent of a generational gap. Young people belief their income is insufficient to live happily and pension costs are eating up the government budget.

Demographics of the Baby Boomers ... building an economy of wealth ... who profited?

by Oui on Thu Apr 16th, 2020 at 07:37:03 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Timeline of all these issues varies, sometimes they intersect ...

"resentment against the austerity of the 1950's"

I grew up in the 1950s in Holland, a devastated country after WWII, rebuilding housing, industry of Rotterdam and manufacturing from Philips. Our family had nothing to spend, lived in poverty but there was no room for resentment. As kids we had a lot of fun, but no toys to play with or for intellectual development. Remember the 1953 storm and floods quite well. In 1957 my parents emigrated to the U.S.

Family: What do you mean, the good old days?

Austerity addicts: why is 1940s nostalgia all the rage?

by Oui on Sat Apr 11th, 2020 at 08:33:39 PM EST
[ Parent ]
After the victory over Germany, the allied nations participated in the Marshall Plan.

Living for five years under Nazi occupation, terror, torture, executions ... citizens of the Western nations wanted CHANGE. Roosevelt and Truman wanted colonialism to cease and urged the empire nations to set the colonies free. A major economic jolt to Europe at the time. The riches were pilfered for centuries from overseas territory.

The African Americans fought for their country and died. By returning, it was a matter of some years and they too wanted to be free as the white man. The great losses during the Vietnam War added further urgency. The Black men died, the White privileged studied in the university and got deferments.

Racism is the history of Slavery, Civil War and Ku Klux Klan

Civil Rights movement is about leadership of MLK and Black Power activism. The FBI countered and put the label of Communism on the movements.

How the Black Power Movement Influenced the Civil Rights Movement

Kicked Out of Olympics in 1968 for Racial Protest, Sprinters Smith and Carlos Now Going to Hall of Fame

by Oui on Sat Apr 11th, 2020 at 08:53:41 PM EST
[ Parent ]
In the 1960s, there was a culmination of multiple events. After WWII, there is always an economic slowdown. The women who filled the jobs in the war industry as the men fought in the Pacific and overseas in North Africa and Europe, the elements of women power was set in stone. Barry Goldwater and the Conservative movement was a great failure in 1964. However, as the liberal and progressive movements took root in the 60s and 70s, the seeds of right-wing extremism were cultivated and bloomed during the Reagan Years and thereafter. A perfect counterrevolution and the American Catholic Church was a major stakeholder ... so very sad and a root cause of self-destruction.

So the South American countries, its people suffered from fascism ruled by US installed dictators. Death, torture, executions ... even missionaries belonging to progressive, social views to support a oppressed people. German boots of fascism worn by "educators" from the U.S. Army School of the Americas.

On Flower Power .. a countercultural movement:

'Homo Sovieticus' | The Economist - Nov. 2019 |

Some movements are quite universal and reached beyond Iron Curtains of Soviet dictatorship. Kennedy's Cultural Exchange and the power of music, American Rock & Roll ...

How the U.S. Used Jazz as a Cold War Secret Weapon | TIME |
A Brief History of Soviet Rock and Roll | The Atlantic |

Missing Reality ...

Shaping a New America : Flower Power

Like the UTOPIAN SOCIETIES of the 1840s, over 2000 rural communes formed during these turbulent times. Completely rejecting the capitalist system, many communes rotated duties, made their own laws, and elected their own leaders. Some were philosophically based, but others were influenced by new religions. Earth-centered religions, astrological beliefs, and Eastern faiths proliferated across American campuses. Some scholars labeled this trend as the THIRD GREAT AWAKENING.
Most communes, however, faced fates similar to their 19th century forebears. A charismatic leader would leave or the funds would become exhausted, and the commune would gradually dissolve.

One lasting change from the countercultural movement was in American diet. Health food stores sold wheat germ, yogurt, and granola, products completely foreign to the 1950s America.

by Oui on Sat Apr 11th, 2020 at 09:20:26 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Last two topics follow tomorrow ... take care of your health and loved ones.

On a personal note ...

For all faiths, the Easter message is important beyond belief  

by Oui on Sat Apr 11th, 2020 at 09:25:59 PM EST
[ Parent ]
The Paris riots of May 1968: How the frustrations of youth brought France to the brink of revolution | The Independent |

The French always celebrate 1 May with a few riots. They did so this year with added piquancy because it was the 50th anniversary of the famous "Mai 68" when, in the Latin Quarter of Paris, the Left Bank, the whole month was devoted to riotous assembly led by students. In contemplating these events, I recall Wordsworth's often quoted phrase: "Bliss it was in that dawn to be alive" - unless, of course, you were struck by a cobblestone hurled by a student demonstrator or soaked and knocked off balance by a police water cannon.

Presumably those who were demonstrating in Paris last Tuesday have now resumed their normal lives. The point about May 1968, however, is that they didn't go back to college or to work the next day, they carried on, some of them for the whole month. Why was that? After all, economic growth had been unusually strong, the country was calm, both politically and socially, inflation was weak, living standards had been rising and there was little unemployment.

Was it in a way a very 1960s thing? That question is prompted by a French historian of the period, Éric Alary, who observes that "May 68 is seen as a period when audacious moves seemed possible and during which society profoundly changed". For that is an accurate description of the nature of the 1960s, whether in Western Europe or in North America.

...
The intellectual gods of these 1960s students were Marx, Freud and Sartre, the French existentialist philosopher. In a famous passage, Sartre wrote that "God does not exist, and as a result man is forlorn, because neither within himself nor without does he find anything to cling to".

This struck home. For as Bob Dylan sang in 1965 - "How does it feel/How does it feel/To be on your own/With no direction home/Like a complete unknown/Like a rolling stone?"

1968 Paris student riots Europe, Amsterdam - Berlin; USA Berkeley
British Pathé : 1968 Student Protests

by Oui on Sun Apr 12th, 2020 at 09:26:42 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Contemporary ...

Bob Dylan - Like A Rolling Stone - the lyrics

    Once upon a time you dressed so fine
    You threw the bums a dime in your prime, didn't you?
    People'd call, say, "Beware doll, you're bound to fall"
    You thought they were all kiddin' you
    You used to laugh about
    Everybody that was hangin' out
    Now you don't talk so loud
    Now you don't seem so proud
    About having to be scrounging for your next meal.

    How does it feel
    How does it feel
    To be without a home
    Like a complete unknown
    Like a rolling stone?

    You've gone to the finest school all right, Miss Lonely
    But you know you only used to get juiced in it
    And nobody has ever taught you how to live on the street
    And now you find out you're gonna have to get used to it
    You said you'd never compromise
    With the mystery tramp, but now you realize
    He's not selling any alibis
    As you stare into the vacuum of his eyes
    And ask him do you want to make a deal?

    How does it feel
    How does it feel
    To be on your own
    With no direction home
    Like a complete unknown
    Like a rolling stone?

    You never turned around to see the frowns on the jugglers and the clowns
    When they all come down and did tricks for you
    You never understood that it ain't no good
    You shouldn't let other people get your kicks for you
    You used to ride on the chrome horse with your diplomat
    Who carried on his shoulder a Siamese cat
    Ain't it hard when you discover that
    He really wasn't where it's at
    After he took from you everything he could steal.

    How does it feel
    How does it feel
    To be on your own
    With no direction home
    Like a complete unknown
    Like a rolling stone?

    Princess on the steeple and all the pretty people
    They're drinkin', thinkin' that they got it made
    Exchanging all kinds of precious gifts and things
    But you'd better lift your diamond ring, you'd better pawn it babe
    You used to be so amused
    At Napoleon in rags and the language that he used
    Go to him now, he calls you, you can't refuse
    When you got nothing, you got nothing to lose
    You're invisible now, you got no secrets to conceal.

    How does it feel
    How does it feel
    To be on your own
    With no direction home
    Like a complete unknown
    Like a rolling stone?

Speaking of a "domino effect", not in SE Asia, but in the western world as the youth took to power and demanded more democracy in institutions!

Nixon Loses Face: The Kent State deadly shooting - May 4th, 1970

by Oui on Sun Apr 12th, 2020 at 09:35:06 AM EST
[ Parent ]
The Hague Carnegie Institute: Women and Peace

An exhibition about Bertha von Suttner, Aletta Jacobs and other women who have played a role in the (international) peace movement.

At the end of the 19th century, Bertha von Suttner was part of the international peace movement that pioneered the Peace Palace. Attention is also paid to women and Hague women from the Women's Peace Movement (1890-1920) and the Dutch Peace Movement.

See also my entry @BooMan ...

Women's Suffrage Archive Film Clip 1915

    Laura) Jane Addams (September 6, 1860-May 21, 1935) won worldwide recognition in the first third of the twentieth century as a pioneer social worker in America, as a feminist, and as an internationalist. She was born in Cedarville, Illinois, the eighth of nine children. Her father was a prosperous miller and local political leader who served for sixteen years as a state senator and fought as an officer in the Civil War; he was a friend of Abraham Lincoln whose letters to him began «My Dear Double D-'ed Addams».

    Miss Jane Addams of Chicago leads party of 39 women to attend peace meeting in The Hague

by Oui on Sun Apr 12th, 2020 at 11:07:26 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Rocking Against the Right: Political Activism and Popular Music in West Germany, 1979-1980

In the 1970s there were many progressive think tanks on issues to advance peace in the world. In past decades, even renowned institutions changed to right-wing strongholds in promoting "self-defense" and complying with the Industrial-Military Complex led by the United States and its multi-billion weapons corporations who need profits to survive. The Fall of the Berlin Wall put the military industry at a cross-roads. Osama Bin Laden saved their a$$es. May the Saudi monarchy and Crown Prince Salman burn in hell till eternity! NATO needs to be cut back drastically! Mea Culpa by former NATO Head Jaap De Hoop Scheffer many years too late ...

Dutch Institute Clingendael was a founded in 1983 and its first director was Henk Neuman. A respectable person I was acquainted with. It was truly an think tank focused on promotion of peace in the world. In 1990 it changed when Joris Voorhoeve took over the reigns and funding came from the Dutch Government Foreign Affairs and Defence. Before the merger, Neuman was director of Netherlands Institute for Questions of Peace (NIVV).

US Foreign Policy from Crisis to Crisis
New American Century - A Balance of ME Failure

Related reading ...

Whatever Happened to Peace? Arms, Oil and War by Proxy  

by Oui on Sun Apr 12th, 2020 at 11:16:16 AM EST
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Once you're dead, you're pretty much irrelevant. If you are in a nursing home, you're pretty much next to dead.
Another unadvertised effect of neoliberalism: if ya ain't producing for the machine, ya may as well be dead.
by Andhakari on Sat Apr 11th, 2020 at 05:59:36 AM EST
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