Bomb in central London

by Lupin Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 10:13:51 AM EST

This is the BBC report at 10:26 am French time: link

One police source said the bomb was a "big device" and posed a real and substantial threat to the area around Haymarket, which is in London's theatreland. But a Westminster source said it was a "relatively small" device.

More substantially -- or weirdly -- I note this:

Bouncers from a nearby nightclub said they saw [a silver mercedes] the car being driven erratically before it crashed into a bin [at 4 am]. They said the driver then got out and ran off.

Is it me, or does this sound like a grand masterplan cooked up by Al-Baldric in his garage after the ingestion of one too many drinks?

If you want to set up a car bomb in London, you do not drive it drunk and crash it into a trashcan at 4 am.

Bloody amateurs.

from the diaries ~ whataboutbob

Bomb in central London | 88 comments (88 topical, 0 editorial, 0 hidden)

Re: Bomb in central London (4.00 / 2)

The Guardian: Car bomb found in London (June 29, 2007)

A car bomb was today defused in central London after a car was crashed into bins before the driver ran off.
A member of the public alerted Scotland Yard to the vehicle. The bomb, believed to be a crudely-made, propane gas-based device, was made safe.
...
Police are now frantically searching landmark sites across the capital for further explosive devices. They were not sure whether the bomb was a lone device or one of several deployed across London.

And this is the great existential threat to civilisation?

I bet you the car wasn't even stolen, but the driver's own.

Can the last politician to go out the revolving door please turn the lights off?

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 05:51:19 AM EST

Re: Bomb in central London (4.00 / 2)

I've stopped looking for logic, but would you blow up YOUR OWN silver mercedes? (As opposed to stealing one.)

by Lupin on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 05:56:31 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (4.00 / 3)

Or in this case, fail to blow up your own silver Merc.

No word if the Merc was stolen or not. You'd think the police might have included that minor detail in their statements.

You'd also think that if someone wanted to make a big mess, they wouldn't pick one of the less busy streets in the area at 4am.

by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 06:49:13 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (none / 1)

Presumably you'd like to park your car bomb where and when it's not busy.

Can the last politician to go out the revolving door please turn the lights off?

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 06:55:47 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (4.00 / 2)

Al-Baldric?

'Ere, why is it always me what gets picked on?

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 05:51:41 AM EST

Re: Bomb in central London (4.00 / 3)

Because of your collection of giant turnips?

by Lupin on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 05:55:34 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (4.00 / 3)

Inspector Knacker of the Yard here, Monsieur Lupin.

What can you tell us about this individual Baldric and giant turnips? Are these turnips hollow? Could an explosive device be dissimulated therein?

(Anything you say may be taken down and used against you.)

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 06:17:28 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (4.00 / 2)

Knacker of the Yard!

It's a fair cop, guv. You've got me bang to rights.

by Lupin on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 06:41:21 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (4.00 / 8)

It's about time we had another major scare. We might get complacent and start thinking further repressive measures are unnecessary.

"The future is already here -- it's just not very evenly distributed" William Gibson

by ChrisCook (cojockathotmaildotcom) on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 06:09:29 AM EST

Re: Bomb in central London (4.00 / 2)

It's Gordon's big hello.

He's enough of a chump to take this at face value and not ask any hard questions.

by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 06:41:43 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (4.00 / 2)

If Gordon's not in charge, who is?

Can the last politician to go out the revolving door please turn the lights off?

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 06:45:51 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (none / 1)

Not me, honest. Signed: Baldric

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 08:11:44 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (none / 1)

Do I detect a note of cyniscism? :-)

by Lupin on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 06:42:29 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (none / 1)

The eyewitness reports have changed, or maybe the Guardia has "corrected" the eyewitness reports in light of the new information...

According to some witnesses the light metallic green Mercedes saloon was driven erratically and crashed into bins near a nightclub. The driver was then seen running away.

Of course, at 4am in sodium light, light metallic green might be confused for grey. But that doesn't excuse misreporting what the eyewitnesses said.

Oh, and The Haymarket is not exactly a quiet road, though it probably is at 4am.

The Haymarket runs parallel to Lower Regent Street and together the two roads form a one-way system, Lower Regent Street taking northbound traffic and Haymarket taking southbound traffic. The two roads are classified as part of the A4 road which runs from central London to Avonmouth near Bristol.

Wikipedia just added an article on the 2007 Haymarket Bomb Plot.

Can the last politician to go out the revolving door please turn the lights off?

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 07:19:57 AM EST

Re: Bomb in central London (4.00 / 2)

All the articles I've seen say 2:00 in the morning, which would be around chucking out time at the nightclubs during the week (With the added bonus that the injured would be mostly so inflicted with alcohol, you wouldn't be able to anesthatise them to operate, so there would be an increased level of fatalities)

Any idiot can face a crisis - it's day to day living that wears you out.

by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 08:06:37 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (none / 1)

Some photos here.

Looks like we've settled on 2am, which would indeed be busier than 4am.

Although I'm still not sure why The Haymarket would be a target when Piccadilly is just around the corner and is always much busier.

by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 08:26:16 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (4.00 / 5)

Who's to say that Haymarket at 2:00am was the target?

The witnesses just report that it was being driven erratically and that the driver ran away after crashing into some bins. The erratic driving could well be down to the driver not being familiar with the car combined with them being wired on adrenaline (which does funny things to your fine motor control) - the fact that he abandoned the vehicle and scarpered after a mild prang supports the idea that he wasn't exactly the coolest cucumber in the fridge when push came to shove.

The cops haven't released any details of the detonation mechanism yet, so whilst this could have been a suicide run targetting jahiliyyi clubbers it could also have been intended to pre-position a bomb that was intended to wreak havoc at a later, busier time.

Even if it was intended to be a suicide run (and really, what's the point of suicide bombing a soft target?) absent tracking the bomber(s) down and getting the info from them, there's no way for us to know where they were targetting.

Regards
Luke

-- #include witty_sig.h

by silburnl on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 09:09:59 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (4.00 / 2)

Bad form to answer my own post, but a suicide run makes sense for a hardened target and thinking about it, Haymarket is the southbound leg of the one way system around there - which means that the driver was on a plausible route to Whitehall, which has plenty of hardened targets to choose from (including the obvious one of course).

This is all purest speculation of course.

Regards
Luke

-- #include witty_sig.h

by silburnl on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 09:27:26 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (4.00 / 2)

The hardened targets are - well - hardened. You'd break a few windows and scare people, but that would be about it. And the early morning is hardly peak time for Whitehall or Westminster.

No one seems to have commented on the fact that propane cannisters make very bad bombs. The steel casing is extremely thick and you have to leave it to burn for a long time before it explodes.

If the plan was to set fire to the car and then wait for the propane to go up, or even just to fill the car and light a match, that was only ever marginally likely to work.

by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 01:25:14 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (none / 1)

True, all true.

by the stormy present (stormypresent aaaaaaat gmail etc) on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 01:51:56 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (4.00 / 2)

I think if you were going to leave the bomb for later, you'd pick a different area altogether.

Pedestrian traffic peaks around 11pm-midnight in that part of London, with a smaller peak at chucking out time, which is anywhere between 2-4pm.

But if you wanted to leave a bomb near Whitehall or Westminster - both of which are very close - the chances of not being discovered are not great.

In no way does this make any sense, except possibly as a message for Gordo.

If you want maximum carnage you wait for the weekend.

If you want a more high profile target, you don't use a high profile Merc with windows that everyone can see into as they walk by.

Meanwhile everyone is - conveniently - already assuming this is an Islamic radical plot, based so far on no real evidence to support that idea.

by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 09:34:41 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (none / 1)

Well if the target was anywhere else other than central London, then anyone with half a brain would avoid it altogether. and avoid the extra security that is hanging about there. It's an extra thing that can go wrong. I don't think there's an Arabic assumption here, it could be right wing Nationalist Christians taking a bomb to the Gay area of London, which isn't that far away.

Any idiot can face a crisis - it's day to day living that wears you out.

by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 10:00:53 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (4.00 / 2)

And of course, for maximum casualties you have to aim for between 2am and 4am.

by Solveig (link2ageataol.com) on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 12:09:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (4.00 / 2)

Well we can probably all think of several ways of creating not just more casualties, but much more disruption but probably don't want to give anyone any ideas

Any idiot can face a crisis - it's day to day living that wears you out.

by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 12:20:47 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (4.00 / 4)

True enough.

It still looks a bit Keystone Kops vs Inept Terrorists though.

by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 01:26:31 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (4.00 / 2)

well sooner or later they are going to learn. (Unless they are actually all suicide bombers)

Any idiot can face a crisis - it's day to day living that wears you out.

by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 01:44:01 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (4.00 / 4)

Possibly not.

Considering the hysteria, and considering how easy it is for someone with even half a brain to do a whole lot of damage, actions are some way short of the political rhetoric about them.

This is a good thing. But it suggests that it's the political rhetoric that has become uncalibrated, and not so much that scary people are working hard at trying to live up to it.

by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 01:49:09 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (4.00 / 5)

More like

Police scaremongering against I-do-not-know-how-to-build-a-damned-bomb terrorists...

Now seriously .. how is the press buying that with 60 gallons and "metralla" in a car you can make tens of casualties...

are they joking? pissed? Stupid? insane?

The only way to kill 10 people with this sort of artifacts it is if half of them were inside the car and the other five very close to the windows...but like having sex ont he windows of the car.

The press really keeps on surprissing me.. really.. flabbergasted... that's the word.. flabbergasted... geee

A pleasure

I therefore claim to show, not how men think in myths, but how myths operate in men's minds without their being aware of the fact. Levi-Strauss, Claude

by kcurie on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 08:21:03 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (4.00 / 4)

Flabbergasted me too - the nice young woman who announces what it has been decided is "the news" on French public radio this morning told me - on the highest authority - that the London car bomb attack "bore the mark of Al Qaeda".

Now just what mark would that be?

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Sat Jun 30th, 2007 at 02:25:07 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (4.00 / 4)

the London car bomb attack "bore the mark of Al Qaeda".

My guess is if it really had the mark of Al Qaeda" it would have been succesful and Larry Johnson seems to be on to something calling them "yuppie terrorists".

by Fran on Sat Jun 30th, 2007 at 02:53:50 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (4.00 / 3)

Maybe there was a 'Made in Iran' sticker on one of cannisters.

Let's have a collection of silly media content:

BBC security correspondent Frank Gardner said simultaneous, co-ordinated bombs have been historically a distinguishing feature of al-Qaeda attacks.

Because no one has ever had that idea before.

Deputy Assistant Commissioner Peter Clarke, head of Scotland Yard's counter-terrorism command, said the discovery of the second device was "obviously troubling" and "reinforces the need for the public to be alert".
Earlier he had said the Haymarket incident "resonated" with previous cases.

Resonated? How? Which cases? Maybe my memory is going, but I don't remember any Merc-based car bombs recently. There was that Barot nutter last year, who was another off-the-peg fantasists who was never in any danger of getting the tools or materials together for an attack.

Good to know that the discovery of a second potential bomb is troubling though.

Good progress is said to have already been made in the search of CCTV footage, with unconfirmed reports suggesting police may have an image of a suspect leaving the vehicle left outside the Tiger Tiger club in Haymarket.

Which means they may have fuzzy lined video that's completely useless for identifying anyone. If they have anything at all.

by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Sat Jun 30th, 2007 at 06:58:22 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (4.00 / 2)

I must say that what L. J. says makes perfect sense actually.

I can imagine someone reading soemthing from a weird web page about resistence, oprresion and evil violent pseudoanarchism... tooking and artifact which is like an hyubrid of a moltov cocktail and plastic explosive with metralla... and using it with teh "al-qaeda brand"...

After one week of training , a brand-new young ETA activist knows more about explosives that those nerds.

A pleasure

I therefore claim to show, not how men think in myths, but how myths operate in men's minds without their being aware of the fact. Levi-Strauss, Claude

by kcurie on Sun Jul 1st, 2007 at 07:57:03 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (4.00 / 3)

I do keep looking at what we've been told, and the Glasgow attack specifically, and think that they have got their entire training from watching hollywood action films. the idea that a car packed with petrol is going to go up like a bomb is a bit of a reach.

Any idiot can face a crisis - it's day to day living that wears you out.

by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Sun Jul 1st, 2007 at 03:42:01 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (4.00 / 2)

Incompetence?

Can the last politician to go out the revolving door please turn the lights off?

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Sat Jun 30th, 2007 at 03:18:19 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (4.00 / 4)

How may half witted failed terrorist attecks is this in a row?

The thing that really made me boggle yesterday was a "Terrorism expert" on Sky who told us with all seriousness that the terrorist websites even had helplines for when you had trouble building your bomb!

which raised the question what music do they have when you're on hold? and have they outsourced that to India which with the misunderstandings that always come with that are causing the current chain of failed bombs?

Any idiot can face a crisis - it's day to day living that wears you out.

by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Sat Jun 30th, 2007 at 03:31:20 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (none / 1)

I wouldn't like to get on their help line.

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Sat Jun 30th, 2007 at 06:17:35 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (none / 1)

well I was thinking 6 years into the war on terror and the terrorists don't jus have training camps, they can run a telephone helplinewe're doing even less well than I thought.

(Might be worth the security services ringing this number and asking to speak to Osama as well) ;-)

Any idiot can face a crisis - it's day to day living that wears you out.

by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Sat Jun 30th, 2007 at 08:49:47 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (none / 1)

Something like this emblazoned on the car, I think.

by Lupin on Sat Jun 30th, 2007 at 12:51:51 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (4.00 / 3)

Alcohol also decreases the blood's ability to clot, which would mean that wounded intoxicated people might bleed to death more easily than sober ones.

by the stormy present (stormypresent aaaaaaat gmail etc) on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 09:44:43 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (none / 1)

It also makes them more limber, so that if thrown from a vehicle an intoxicated person is much more likely to survive than a sober one.

Bottom line here, as a wise man once told me. You can drink or you can drive, but you can't drink and drive.

And I'll give my consent to any government that does not deny a man a living wage-Billy Bragg

by ManfromMiddletown (manfrommiddletown at lycos dot com) on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 11:27:56 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (none / 1)

You mean it could have killed more people than those in car accidents in a week?

Scary stuff.

Oh wait.. maybe it was just on of the accidents.. oh the irony...

A pleasure

I therefore claim to show, not how men think in myths, but how myths operate in men's minds without their being aware of the fact. Levi-Strauss, Claude

by kcurie on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 08:05:18 AM EST

Re: Bomb in central London (4.00 / 2)

Interesting. It will be fascinating to see who the are is registered to.

Judging just by the car, this could simply be a case of an overzealous and cash-flow-challenged entrepreneur looking to convert his business assets into cash.

The fact is that what we're experiencing right now is a top-down disaster. -Paul Krugman

by dvx (dvx.clt ät gmail dotcom) on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 10:28:50 AM EST

Deja vu all over again (none / 1)

From the BBC site

A controlled explosion was carried out on the car, packed with 60 litres of petrol, gas cylinders and nails, in Haymarket, near Piccadilly Circus.

Was one of you lot recording me last week ? Tho' my idea was better. But Crazyhorse's had elegance.

keep to the Fen Causeway

by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 10:52:01 AM EST

Re: Deja vu all over again (none / 1)

According to the wikipedia timeline there was no controlled explosion in the car but the police removed the explosive devices (gas canisters). I suppose that way they avoid eliminating valuable evidence if there is any.

Can the last politician to go out the revolving door please turn the lights off?

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 11:17:09 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Deja vu all over again (none / 1)

I remember that conversation (though as far as I remember there was no mention of the nails).

The fact is that what we're experiencing right now is a top-down disaster. -Paul Krugman

by dvx (dvx.clt ät gmail dotcom) on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 12:14:28 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Hmm, under-convinced (4.00 / 2)

I heard it described on the radio as a "device of explosive capability". That's not a description of a bomb, that's a suspicious aggregation of potential ingredients. Kinda like have a bag of sugar and a bottle of weedkiller in the same vehicle.

keep to the Fen Causeway

by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 10:54:37 AM EST

explosive capacity (4.00 / 4)

Maybe they mean the gas tank? 60 litres of highly explosive, and highly polluting (all that fossil fuel waste) substance.

In the long run, we're all dead. John Maynard Keynes

by Jerome a Paris (etg@eurotrib.com) on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 11:31:21 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: explosive capacity (none / 1)

Which takes me back to the conversation I had in Paris on Saturday night. Don't ask, I'm not gonna post it on the net.

keep to the Fen Causeway

by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 11:35:21 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: explosive capacity (none / 1)

Don't worry, Helen, me no talk.

"Life shrinks or expands in proportion to one's courage." - Anaïs Nin

by Crazy Horse on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 07:01:25 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Hehe (4.00 / 4)

L C Johnson has an excellent line:

You know what you call a vehicle with 50 gallons of gas? A Cadillac Escalade. The media meltdown over this incident is simply shameful.

In the long run, we're all dead. John Maynard Keynes

by Jerome a Paris (etg@eurotrib.com) on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 11:42:57 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Hehe (4.00 / 3)

I once inherited a Cadillac deVille. It was longer than a house (I had to take off the back bumper to get it into my garage), had 500 cubic inches displacement weighed over 5,000 lbs, and had a 27 gallon gas tank. Surprisingly, it got 20mpg on the open road and the comfort on a long trip was unsurpassed. Unfortunately, it got around 10mpg in town and rusted like crazy. I gave it to charity and it was auctioned off. I loved that car, even if it was a rusting gas guzzler.

I can swear there ain't no heaven but I pray there ain't no hell. _ Blood Sweat & Tears

by Gringo (stargazing camel at aoldotcom) on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 09:16:36 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: explosive capacity (none / 1)

It was rather bizarre to wake up to see the media freaking out about a car found with what they described as "several containers of gas" in it.

I guess a car can either be a basic human right or a bomb, depending upon which is more politically expedient that day...

"Pretending that you already know the answer when you don't is not actually very helpful." ~Migeru.

by poemless on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 11:48:06 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: explosive capacity (none / 0)

"Gas" means propane, not petrol.

Can the last politician to go out the revolving door please turn the lights off?

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 11:50:06 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: explosive capacity (4.00 / 2)

Migeru, living in America, I get American TV, where American English is used. "Gas" is the word used in America for the stuff you fill up your tank with, not "petrol". And Matt Lauer reported that the car in question was found with "several containers of gas inside it", not "propane". So you have a situation where one moment reporters are interviewing people filling up their cars with gas and complaining about the prices, and the next moment a reporter is telling us that a car found carrying gas in it has spawned a terror alert. You can see how weird it would sound to us...

"Pretending that you already know the answer when you don't is not actually very helpful." ~Migeru.

by poemless on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 12:01:21 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (4.00 / 5)

Headlines on all the news programs this morning:

"Terrifying discovery made in London today;" "Spice Girls are getting back together..."

LOL.

"Pretending that you already know the answer when you don't is not actually very helpful." ~Migeru.

by poemless on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 10:58:45 AM EST

reunion fever (none / 1)

snigger.

there's a rumour Led Zep are getting back together. Hmmm, could be a problem with the drummer there.

keep to the Fen Causeway

by Helen (lareinagal at yahoo dot co dot uk) on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 11:21:56 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: reunion fever (none / 0)

Aah, didn't that rumour start pretty much when Led Zeppelin broke up? Still, they could always go with Jason Bonham (deceased Zep drummer John Bonham's son)...

"The basis of optimism is sheer terror" - Oscar Wilde

by NordicStorm (m<-at->sturmbaum.net) on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 05:01:25 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: reunion fever (none / 1)

that's been a constant rumour for at least the last ten years.

Any idiot can face a crisis - it's day to day living that wears you out.

by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 08:41:13 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (4.00 / 3)

Kudos! That hadn't occurred to me, but I think you've nailed the motive.

The fact is that what we're experiencing right now is a top-down disaster. -Paul Krugman

by dvx (dvx.clt ät gmail dotcom) on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 11:42:19 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (none / 0)

I admit to liking the following Spice Girls song:

Candle light and soul forever
A dream of you and me together
Say you believe it, say you believe it

Free your mind of doubt and danger
Be for real don't be a stranger
We can achieve it, we can achieve it

Come a little bit closer baby, get it on, get it on
'Cause tonight is the night when two become one

[Chorus:]
I need some love like I never needed love before
(Wanna make love to ya baby)
I had a little love, now I'm back for more
(Wanna make love to ya baby)
Set your spirit free, it's the only way to be

Silly games that you were playing
Empty words we both were saying
Let's work it out boy, let's work it out boy

any deal that we endeavour
Love will bring us back together
Take it or leave it, take it or leave it

Are you as good as I remember baby, get it on, get it on
'Cause tonight is the night when two become one

you are the media you consume.

by MillMan (millguy at gmail) on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 04:40:00 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (none / 0)

If you wanna be my lover, you gotta get with my friends,
Make it last forever friendship never ends,
If you wanna be my lover, you have got to give,
Taking is too easy, but that's the way it is.

Truly some of the most gifted songwriting in history. So profound ... it's humbling.

"Pretending that you already know the answer when you don't is not actually very helpful." ~Migeru.

by poemless on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 04:46:27 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (none / 0)

Wait...is this 2007, or 1997? Next you're telling me Take That and the Backstreet Boys are reuniting...

"The basis of optimism is sheer terror" - Oscar Wilde

by NordicStorm (m<-at->sturmbaum.net) on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 05:02:31 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (none / 0)

No jury in the world would convict.

The fact is that what we're experiencing right now is a top-down disaster. -Paul Krugman

by dvx (dvx.clt ät gmail dotcom) on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 05:22:34 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (none / 0)

Hey, I didn't sign off on that one.

you are the media you consume.

by MillMan (millguy at gmail) on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 06:01:27 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (none / 0)

I think that is the best Spice Girls song (maybe I should get out more).

by Gary J on Mon Jul 2nd, 2007 at 08:27:32 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (4.00 / 3)

Went to look at what the press has to say about this again...

Guardian Unlimited: Police: car bomb may have been inspired by al-Qaida (June 29, 2007)

Senior police and Whitehall sources today said the failed attempt to inflict mass murder in central London was the work of al-Qaida or those inspired by its ideology.
One senior source said: "You only have to read past cases of those convicted for terrorism to realise they have been plotting to blow up nightclubs and putting gas cylinder bombs in cars."

Unsubstantiated Speculation™ brought to you by the Metropolitan Police.

The police has also increased its presence in the capital.
"At this stage we are deploying an enhanced level of patrolling in key areas in central London and across the capital," a police statement said. "This is to provide a visible reassurance, and is not in response to any specific threat."
The more visible police presence followed this morning's incident, when a bomb made from gas cylinders, petrol and nails was found in a car in Haymarket, one of the capital's main nightlife districts.

Causing panic while claiming to reassure the people.

The incident began when an ambulance was called to a nightclub around 1am to treat a person who had fallen ill. The ambulance crew noticed a Mercedes parked outside the club, and saw that the vehicle appeared to have smoke inside it.
...
Witnesses said they had seen the light metallic green saloon car being driven erratically earlier. It then crashed into bins before the driver ran away.

So, none of the witnesses to the crash bothered to call the emergency services.

No warnings were received and the foiling of the plot was sheer happenstance.

I thout foiling a plot involving doing something to prevent it, rather than just having the perpetrator fumble. Maybe they mean the "failing" of the plot?

Can the last politician to go out the revolving door please turn the lights off?

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 12:03:08 PM EST

Thiefery, not terrorism? (none / 1)

Maybe he stole the stuff, propane canisters, car and all, and then crashed while leaving, panicked and ran away?

Sweden's finest (and perhaps only) collaborative, leftist e-newspaper Synapze.se

by A swedish kind of death on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 01:41:21 PM EST

Re: Thiefery, not terrorism? (none / 1)

set fire to the car to get rid of the evidence?

Any idiot can face a crisis - it's day to day living that wears you out.

by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 01:45:06 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Thiefery, not terrorism? (4.00 / 2)

It would take a particularly impressive kind of bad luck to boost a car bomb while thinking you were just stealing a flashy car.

by the stormy present (stormypresent aaaaaaat gmail etc) on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 01:53:28 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Thiefery, not terrorism? (4.00 / 2)

Not that flashy; they stopped making that model version in 1995.

Here in Germany it's a kind of car you see old people driving.

The fact is that what we're experiencing right now is a top-down disaster. -Paul Krugman

by dvx (dvx.clt ät gmail dotcom) on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 02:13:45 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (none / 1)

Second car bomb found in London's West End | Uk News | News | Telegraph

Police have found a second car bomb in London's West End, it has emerged.

Fleet Street was cleared while police investigated suspect vehicle
Sources revealed that officers examining a Mercedes found in an underground car park off Park Lane this afternoon discovered an explosive device inside.
It has not been disclosed what sort of bomb was found, but the revelation comes just hours after bomb disposal experts defused a device set to detonate petrol, gas cylinders and nails in a car outside the packed Tiger Tiger nightclub in The Haymarket.
It is thought the second car was found parked illegally in the West End by traffic wardens in the early hours of this morning. It was then towed to the pound - located in the car park - but left outside in the public area when staff reported that it smelt of fuel.

by Fran on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 02:41:52 PM EST

Re: Bomb in central London (4.00 / 3)

I guess the ringleader owns a Mercedes dealership or something.

Can the last politician to go out the revolving door please turn the lights off?

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 03:19:44 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (4.00 / 2)

Or is old and German.

by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 03:26:46 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (4.00 / 2)

Left-over WWII sleeper got a signal at last out of his radio set.

Angela is the German Chancellor.

Time to wake up and act.

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Sat Jun 30th, 2007 at 06:23:17 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (4.00 / 7)

The only explosive device worth considering is a detonator. The rest is wishful thinking.

You can't go too far with cannisters unless you open them in a closed enviroment, as mentioned above. They're built to resist exceptional conditions. Whatever way you look at it, you're dealing with assholes.

by de Gondi (publiobestia aaaatttthotmaildaughtusual) on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 04:32:10 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (4.00 / 2)

Detonators aren't hard to make, most people have the makings sitting about in their houses, doing anything useful with them is another matter entirely. To take the top off a gas cylinder so that its capable of being used as aditional fuel for your explosion would be somewhat tricky.

Any idiot can face a crisis - it's day to day living that wears you out.

by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 08:52:05 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (none / 1)

I'd suggest letting the gas out of the cylinder before pulling out your wrench set- and of course distancing oneself, unless you're into suicide and taking everyone else in the building with you.

by de Gondi (publiobestia aaaatttthotmaildaughtusual) on Sat Jun 30th, 2007 at 06:32:09 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (4.00 / 5)

And let's not forget that someone towed away one of these cars without noticing there was a potential bomb in it. After giving it a parking ticket.

You couldn't make it up. Not even if you tried to.

by ThatBritGuy (thatbritguy (at) googlemail.com) on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 08:52:33 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (none / 0)

it's like ealing comedy makes a comeback!

'The history of public debt is full of irony. It rarely follows our ideas of order and justice.' Thomas Piketty

by melo (melometa4(at)gmail.com) on Sun Jul 1st, 2007 at 07:07:53 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (4.00 / 5)

Is this the London that made rude jokes about the "Jerries" while living through the Blitz?

unbelievable. like a bunch of little kids at camp, scaring each other silly with gory ghost stories.

The difference between theory and practise in practise ...

by DeAnander (de_at_daclarke_dot_org) on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 10:09:03 PM EST

Re: Bomb in central London (4.00 / 2)

Yes, and now led terrorist-enablers, leaders who have abandoned the politics of courage for the politics of weakness, the politics of fear.

(Just working on phrases here.)

Words and ideas I offer here may be used freely and without attribution.

by technopolitical on Fri Jun 29th, 2007 at 11:40:28 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (4.00 / 2)

No, it's not the same London. This is 2007 and that was 1941.

Can the last politician to go out the revolving door please turn the lights off?

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Sat Jun 30th, 2007 at 03:19:17 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (4.00 / 2)

Well that was a national myth and the creation of propaganda as much as anything else. The view of the history of the population during the war has been somewhat idealised.

Any idiot can face a crisis - it's day to day living that wears you out.

by ceebs (ceebs (at) eurotrib (dot) com) on Sat Jun 30th, 2007 at 03:34:45 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (4.00 / 3)

I guess -- my Mum lived through the Blitz so I'm going on her reminiscences, etc. -- as a kid she played in bomb craters, the kids collected bits of shell casings and downed aircraft parts, a downed pilot's parachute was a big prize (silk cloth, which the womenfolk quickly converted into clothing and furnishings)... we once watched that wartime movie, "Hope and Glory," and she said it was very disturbing for being almost too realistic.

Now, people do romanticise their childhood memories, but somehow the attitude that my Mum picked up in childhood was not one of cowering fear: more like scrappy fatalism.

But I agree about the disconnect between the propaganda machinery and the mood of the public. The USian public seems to be far more compliant with their media masters... parroting in daily discourse exactly what Faux News and the WSJ said this morning... but I'm not
"on the street" in the UK so I have no idea whether conversations on the bus and around the office water cooler are parroting the lapdog press in the same way.

The difference between theory and practise in practise ...

by DeAnander (de_at_daclarke_dot_org) on Sat Jun 30th, 2007 at 03:22:26 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (none / 1)

'scrappy fatalism'....brilliantly nailed....

to the ukelele strains of george formby, with marge'n'marmite sarnies.

terrorist actions, even inept ones, are still rare enough not to be taken too seriously by most londoners, unless of course you fall into the staistically tiny bag of peeps who actually saw one face to face.

it's just another cog in the perpetual motion machine, seemingly designed to keep commuters from having a smooth ride home, like strikes, storms and derailments.

next to the blitz, even 7/7 was a pinprick.

scrappy fatalism has morphed into apocalypse overload, and both fear and faith are becoming rapidly virtualised.

adrenalin rules, and the press breathlessly acts like a greek chorus.

'The history of public debt is full of irony. It rarely follows our ideas of order and justice.' Thomas Piketty

by melo (melometa4(at)gmail.com) on Sun Jul 1st, 2007 at 07:18:45 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (4.00 / 2)

This is the same London, and this has bugger all to do with the public attitude, which is extremely matter of fact.

I was there, walking to work with the rest of them on 7/7 past the ambulances, sirens and police tapes.

This is about an implicit conspiracy between an instinctively authoritarian government and a hysterical, strident and shoddy Press.

by Solveig (link2ageataol.com) on Sat Jun 30th, 2007 at 04:33:44 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (none / 1)

frothwhippers, paid by the shiver...

'The history of public debt is full of irony. It rarely follows our ideas of order and justice.' Thomas Piketty

by melo (melometa4(at)gmail.com) on Sun Jul 1st, 2007 at 07:20:03 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Bomb in central London (4.00 / 2)

This is what my friend in London says, and I think he makes some good points:

I think something's fishy about this story,
personally, given that it took them about 12 hours to get the official
story out and that there were on-the-scene witnesses that told a
slightly different story than the "heroic paramedic" version we're now
hearing. I also think the London press in its usual fashion is
exaggerating the potential death toll by a factor of at least 10 (tabs
this morning saying 1,000 people were targeted). We've been to the
restaurant that was supposedly the target (Tiger Tiger), but only for
dinner.

How is it that the IRA never seemed to screw up and got very close to
some very high-value targets in their bombing campaign, I wonder?

by zoe on Sat Jun 30th, 2007 at 02:40:28 PM EST

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