Welcome to European Tribune. It's gone a bit quiet around here these days, but it's still going.

Ukraine "making history" deserves its own thread ...

by vbo Tue Feb 25th, 2014 at 06:32:07 AM EST

Feel free to feed news and putt comments and opinions...It seems that we (some of us) are clogging news room with news from Ukraine and things are going to get even more interesting there in the near future I suppose.I will start with latest news

11:00 GMT:

The EU is waiting for a plan of economic reforms from the new Ukrainian government to decide what kind of foreign financial assistance will be given to Ukraine, said European Union foreign policy chief Catherine Ashton.

The country needs to create a new government, Ashton said.

She gave no details of this assistance, saying the EU would work with the International Monetary Fund but the IMF would make its own assessment of the situation.  


I have a feeling that time is of essence in Ukraine...


Display:
http://voiceofrussia.com/news/2014_02_25/Stabilization-in-Ukraine-is-possible-only-in-presence-of-cl ose-cooperation-between-EU-and-Russia-Luxemburg-FM-4836/

The Ukrainian situation can stabilize only if Russia and the European Union cooperate closely, Luxembourg Foreign Minister Jean Asselborn said, the Voice of Russia correspondent reports.  
Asselborn told a press conference after negotiating with his Russian counterpart Sergei Lavrov that he personally and the European Union as a whole were confident that close cooperation between the EU and Russia was the only way to achieve normalization and stability in Ukraine.

RT also said that Luxemburg is calling for Ukrainians to curb violence...
Well it seems they are now pushing Luxemburg to ask Russians for help ...someone will have to as things are only going to escalate soon...

Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind...Albert Einstein

by vbo on Tue Feb 25th, 2014 at 06:50:14 AM EST
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/feb/24/ukraine-protests-warrant-arrest-viktor-yanukovych-live- updates?view=classic#block-530b3d36e4b04f22a42ea33c


Summary

* The Russian prime minister, Dmitry Medvedev, has criticised western countries' recognition of the legitimacy of Ukraine's transitional government as an "aberration", describing the ousting of President Viktor Yanukovych as a "mutiny". The former president also said that it would be difficult to Russia to work with people with "black masks and Kalashnikov rifles". The Russian foreign ministry later echoed his comments and accused the west of encouraging neo-Nazi and anti-Semitic extremists.

The Russian prime minister, Dmitry Medvedev, is also quoted as saying:

We do not understand what is going on there. There is a real threat to our interests and to the lives of our citizens. There are big doubts about the legitimacy of a whole series of organs of power that are now functioning there.


Oh now he is talking "threat to our interests and lives of our citizens"...that's how it all started in Georgia...

Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind...Albert Einstein
by vbo on Tue Feb 25th, 2014 at 06:58:54 AM EST
Viktor Yanukovych was ready to 'use troops to crush Ukraine protests' | World news | theguardian.com

Before he was ousted as Ukraine's president, Viktor Yanukovych drew up plans to use thousands of troops to crush the protests that eventually toppled him, according to a leaked document published online.

Ukrainian journalists are going through thousands of papers they say were found near Yanukovych's opulent residence near Kiev after he fled the capital, and some documents have already started to surface in the internet.

Although its authenticity could not be confirmed, parliamentary deputy Hennadi Moskal, a former deputy interior minister, published a document online detailing a plan to surround Independence Square - the cradle of the uprising - with snipers and open fire on the protesters below.



It is rightly acknowledged that people of faith have no monopoly of virtue - Queen Elizabeth II
by eurogreen on Tue Feb 25th, 2014 at 07:28:02 AM EST
Here in Australia on ABC news they say all tho it is not confirmed that Russian additional marines were sent to Sevastopol's military base.

Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind...Albert Einstein
by vbo on Tue Feb 25th, 2014 at 07:28:27 AM EST
Guardian
Authorities in the southern Ukrainian city of Sevastopol have installed a pro-Russian mayor as fears grow that the Kremlin may be stoking separatist sentiment in the region.

Sevastopol's city council handed power to Aleksei Chaliy, a Russian citizen, during an extraordinary session on Monday evening while more than a thousand protesters gathered around city hall chanting "Russia, Russia, Russia," and "A Russian mayor for a Russian city."

by gk (gk (gk quattro due due sette @gmail.com)) on Tue Feb 25th, 2014 at 07:31:47 AM EST
[ Parent ]
I'd be shocked if that hadn't happened already.
by rifek on Tue Feb 25th, 2014 at 06:26:49 PM EST
[ Parent ]
I saw either the new mayor or a supporter quoted on PBS evening news as saying, (roughly): "If Parliament in Kiev can appoint a new President of the Ukraine the city council in Sevastopol can appoint a new Mayor."

"It is not necessary to have hope in order to persevere."
by ARGeezer (ARGeezer a in a circle eurotrib daught com) on Wed Feb 26th, 2014 at 01:36:16 AM EST
[ Parent ]
11:51 GMT:

The Ukrainian parliament Verkhovna Rada has voted in favor of President Yanukovich being tried in the International Criminal Court (ICC) located in The Hague for alleged serious crimes.

Ex-Interior Minister Vitaly Zakharchenko and former Prosecutor General Viktor Pshonka are among those whom the Rada wants to be tried in the ICC.

All are accused of "crimes against humanity during the peaceful protests in the period of November 30, 2013, and February 22, 2014."

Three hundred and twenty-four MPs voted in favor of the resolution.


Oh yeah...send them to your friends...
Peaceful protesters huh



Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind...Albert Einstein

by vbo on Tue Feb 25th, 2014 at 07:57:46 AM EST
Why bring in the ICC? Are they incapable of putting him on trial themselves?
by gk (gk (gk quattro due due sette @gmail.com)) on Tue Feb 25th, 2014 at 10:09:39 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Well, look at the Timoshenko trial... that went well.

The short answer is "obviously". However, I think it unlikely he meets the threshold for the Hague.

It is rightly acknowledged that people of faith have no monopoly of virtue - Queen Elizabeth II

by eurogreen on Tue Feb 25th, 2014 at 10:41:58 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Here's some Western media story-telling:

In Ukraine turbulence, a lad from Lviv becomes the toast of Kiev | Reuters

(Reuters) - When the history of the bloody turbulence in Ukraine is written, a 26-year-old who learned combat skills in the army cadets may be recorded as the man who made up Viktor Yanukovich's mind to cut and run.

Cars toot a welcome and passers-by press the hand of Volodymyr Parasiuk, a boyish-looking individual who finds it embarrassing to be called a hero.

He reserves that title for his comrades and other protesters among the 80 or so people killed on the capital's streets last week in three days of fighting against Yanukovich's police.

But after opposition leaders had signed an EU-brokered deal with President Yanukovich to end the conflict, it was Parasiuk who commandeered the microphone on Friday night to turn the crowd against it.

With former boxing champion and opposition leader Vitaly Klitschko looking on stony-faced, Parasiuk, from the western city of Lviv, made an electrifying impromptu speech denouncing the opposition for "shaking hands with this killer".

No-one was going to wait for an election later in the year, he said. Yanukovich had to get out of town by the following morning or face the consequences.

To the dismay of opposition leaders, Parasiuk's emotional address - he broke down on several occasions as he remembered dead comrades - touched a chord deep within the thousands on Independence Square who roared their approval.

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Tue Feb 25th, 2014 at 07:59:49 AM EST
Yeah I remember that video.He was the one who took microphone and said that if Yanukovich will not resign now they are coming to kill him"
What a hero!
Well history (of Ukraine)and this mess that may very well fall out of hands is not finished yet.I am afraid it is just starting. We need to see who will survive (I am afraid they may not be winners here in this nuclear era) to write history...

Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind...Albert Einstein
by vbo on Tue Feb 25th, 2014 at 08:10:36 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Op-ed from the NYT:

Has the West Already Lost Ukraine? - NYTimes.com

When, on Saturday, Ukraine's new leaders thanked all of those who had contributed to the overthrow of President Viktor F. Yanukovych, the European Union was one of the last to be cited. And deservedly so: At the height of the crisis, the most the union was ready to do was announce sanctions against individual members of Mr. Yanukovych's regime.

It is true that the foreign ministers of Germany and Poland worked hard to negotiate a truce between the opposition and Mr. Yanukovych. But their determination came not from the belief that a strong Europe stood behind them, but rather from the awareness that the West would not defend the opposition if it came under attack by Mr. Yanukovych's armed forces or those of President Vladimir Putin of Russia.

The events of the last week have made it clear that the European Union is an attractive economic arrangement -- but one that is devoid of opportunities for pursuing serious foreign or defense policies.

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Tue Feb 25th, 2014 at 08:07:32 AM EST
but one that is devoid of opportunities for pursuing serious foreign or defense policies.

Yeah only Americans are capable to make good big and bloody wars and all of us others only need to pay for it and send few troops to be trained. American's always regarded Europeans as sissies (if this is a right spieling)...except Germans...

Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind...Albert Einstein
by vbo on Tue Feb 25th, 2014 at 08:18:21 AM EST
[ Parent ]
If I may translate that : "but one that is unwilling to invade and occupy neighbouring states".

And for that I am thankful.

It's easy to say that the EU is weak; but is that necessarily a bad thing? The EU offers a package of trade and economic assistance. It tries to broker a deal between factions, is still trying (I guess) to get the winning side to maintain constitutional legality. I don't see what it could have done fundamentally better.

I was surprised that the regime caved; I suspect it was the oligarchs who pulled the plug on Yakunovich (I'm guessing they obtained a guarantee of business as usual from the opposition)

The problem is that this is a stinging defeat for Putin. His ideology and methodology are clear, there has to be a military response, unless he can somehow save face in some sort of a deal with the EU.

It is rightly acknowledged that people of faith have no monopoly of virtue - Queen Elizabeth II

by eurogreen on Tue Feb 25th, 2014 at 08:45:18 AM EST
[ Parent ]
The EU understands what the US refuses to: the difficulty of projecting force into Ukraine in the face of opposition from Moscow.
by rifek on Tue Feb 25th, 2014 at 06:33:04 PM EST
[ Parent ]
We hope!

"It is not necessary to have hope in order to persevere."
by ARGeezer (ARGeezer a in a circle eurotrib daught com) on Wed Feb 26th, 2014 at 01:39:57 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Given that quote about EU financial assistance, this old story is well worth remembering: Merkel wanted to export austerity to the Ukraine (Eurointelligence, 26.11.2013)
The Eastern Partnership is definitely off our reservation, but nevertheless we feel there is an overlooked aspect in Ukraine's suspension of the talks with a more direct relevance to our debate. We would like to draw attention to a little-reported speech delivered on last Monday the 18th by Angela Merkel to the Bundestag (video) in which she demanded that Ukraine engage in fiscal consolidation as part of the agreement. We have found this speech reported in English only in the Russian site Vestnik Kavkaza.
...An additional serious problem for Ukraine is fiscal consolidation. Without serious finances, there will be no agreement on economic support from the IMF. We believe that such an agreement with Ukraine is necessary. Bilateral credits of the EU for macrofinancal support of Ukraine depend on this.

We constantly recommend Ukraine to conduct reforms. We cannot do this for the Ukrainian government. The reforms should be provided, notwithstanding, the association agreement will be signed or not. We understand that they cannot be provided in a single day.

We also would like to support Ukraine in its reforms by our cooperation and financial aid for the European neighboring policy, but Ukraine has to provide necessary conditions for this. And it has to do it right now.

Seeing how well German-inspired macroeconomic management of the eurozone is turning out, we cannot fault the Ukrainian government for not wanting to unduly restrict its macroeconomic policy space in exchange for a status which does not even amount to that of Turkey. As with Syria and Iran, the EU has delivered an easy political victory to Putin by overplaying its hand. We noted a comment in Berliner Zeitung that "the advantages of the association agreement are abstract" while "Moscow's threats and promises have been wonderfully concrete".


A society committed to the notion that government is always bad will have bad government. And it doesn't have to be that way. — Paul Krugman
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Tue Feb 25th, 2014 at 09:26:18 AM EST
And the Ukraine has strong memories of forced starvation by occupiers.


"It is not necessary to have hope in order to persevere."
by ARGeezer (ARGeezer a in a circle eurotrib daught com) on Wed Feb 26th, 2014 at 01:40:52 AM EST
[ Parent ]
http://www.abc.net.au/lateline/

Putin could move against Crimea

Wach this interview...

Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind...Albert Einstein

by vbo on Tue Feb 25th, 2014 at 09:32:23 AM EST
"against" or "on"?

A society committed to the notion that government is always bad will have bad government. And it doesn't have to be that way. — Paul Krugman
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Tue Feb 25th, 2014 at 09:47:20 AM EST
[ Parent ]


A society committed to the notion that government is always bad will have bad government. And it doesn't have to be that way. — Paul Krugman
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Tue Feb 25th, 2014 at 09:55:55 AM EST


A society committed to the notion that government is always bad will have bad government. And it doesn't have to be that way. — Paul Krugman
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Tue Feb 25th, 2014 at 09:56:48 AM EST
[ Parent ]
It's also important to recall that the Roman Empire laid the foundation of the English state, including Edward Leigh's own Lincolnshire. I'm not sure what follows from that, though.
by gk (gk (gk quattro due due sette @gmail.com)) on Tue Feb 25th, 2014 at 10:01:36 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Viktor Yanukovych boasted of Ukraine corruption, says Mikheil Saakashvili | World news | theguardian.com

Ukraine's disgraced president, Viktor Yanukovych, used to boast to other heads of state about how corrupt he was, according to Georgia's former president Mikheil Saakashvili.

Yanukovych, who fled Kiev at the weekend and is believed now to be hiding in Crimea, was known for his thuggish behaviour and obsession with money. The extent of his interest in the latter was revealed over the weekend when his lavish presidential compound outside Kiev was opened to the public.

Saakashvili's comments suggest the Ukrainian leader was brazen in his abuse of office. Saakashvili was president of Georgia from 2004 until November, and met Yanukovych on numerous occasions.

He recalled one incident in particular, at the 2011 UN general assembly in New York, when he said Yanukovych bragged at length about how his corrupt government worked, in front of Saakashvili and a group of leaders from post-Soviet countries.

"He would talk very loudly about how he had corrupted senior officials, in the supreme court and the constitutional court," Saakashvili said during an interview in the Ukrainian capital, where he is meeting with opposition leaders after Yanukovych's downfall. "He didn't care who he was talking to; the guy did not have any idea about morality."

Saakashvili said Yanukovych was unique among post-Soviet leaders, even the notoriously ruthless and corrupt central Asian dictators.



It is rightly acknowledged that people of faith have no monopoly of virtue - Queen Elizabeth II
by eurogreen on Tue Feb 25th, 2014 at 10:56:57 AM EST
I'm not sure the very American Mikheil Saakashvili is the most impeccable of witnesses...
by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Tue Feb 25th, 2014 at 11:39:43 AM EST
[ Parent ]
It takes a corrupt oligarch to know one.

A society committed to the notion that government is always bad will have bad government. And it doesn't have to be that way. — Paul Krugman
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Tue Feb 25th, 2014 at 11:43:44 AM EST
[ Parent ]
The liar from the Ossetian War, Mikheil Saakashvili, a trusted source? I prefer the remarks made by Mikhail Gorbachev. The lad from Lvov, a hero ...

Nazi Collaboration by Banderists in East Galicia.

Global Warming - distance between America and Europe is steadily increasing.

by Oui on Tue Feb 25th, 2014 at 11:44:08 AM EST
[ Parent ]
That article forgot to mention the war when recounting his career. Also forgot this:

Mikheil Saakashvili - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The pressure against Saakashvili intensified in 2009, when the opposition launched mass demonstrations against Saakashvili's rule. On 5 May 2009, Georgian police said large-scale disorders were planned in Georgia of which the failed army mutiny was part. According to the police, Saakashvili's assassination had also been plotted.[24] Opposition figures dispute the claim of an attempted mutiny and instead say that troops refused an illegal order to use force against opposition demonstrators[25]

So what is he doing nowadays?

Mikheil Saakashvili - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

In December 2013, he accepted the position of lecturer and senior statesman at Tufts University in the United States. [5]

US pawn calls Russian pawn greedy. Pot, meet kettle.

Sweden's finest (and perhaps only) collaborative, leftist e-newspaper Synapze.se

by A swedish kind of death on Tue Feb 25th, 2014 at 11:47:26 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Former president of Georgia Mikheil Saakashvili to join Tufts University - Tufts - Your Campus - Boston.com

One month after the end his decade-long run as president of the country of Georgia, Mikheil Saakashvili announced he will join Tufts University.

Starting in January [2014], Saakashvili will work as a as senior statesman at the Fletcher School of Law and Diplomacy, the university's gradate school of international affairs, which the Saakashvili called "one of the greatest institutions specialized in these fields in the world."

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Tue Feb 25th, 2014 at 11:52:13 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Former first lady of Georgia, Sandra Roelofs, still lives and works in Georgia and most likely has the care of their two sons. Saakashvili lives in exile in the US and fears for his life. Ms. Roelofs is a noted advocate for women and girls and founded the charity foundation, SOCO which is active in advancing reproductive health and neonatal care.

Sandra Roelofs, first lady of Georgia, tells her personal story in Zeeuws Vlaanderen - [dutch]

Global Warming - distance between America and Europe is steadily increasing.

by Oui on Tue Feb 25th, 2014 at 03:45:08 PM EST
[ Parent ]
One must feel pity for his ( American) students...They'll have a lot to learn from him ;)

Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind...Albert Einstein
by vbo on Tue Feb 25th, 2014 at 09:03:08 PM EST
[ Parent ]
It was not my intention to accredit Saakashvili as an honourable source. But what he says is consistent with what is known about Yanukovych from other sources.

It is rightly acknowledged that people of faith have no monopoly of virtue - Queen Elizabeth II
by eurogreen on Tue Feb 25th, 2014 at 12:25:30 PM EST
[ Parent ]
What he said is consistent with what we know about Timoshenko too and her predecessor and a lot of others in power all over the world.Corruption is world wide phenomenon (it is just hidden better in west world) and there is no one who "loves money" more then Americans.
Trouble is when money starts to "evaporate" then those tugs start to fight each other. Poor people have nothing to do with that fight, they are just used and will never see money. As one criminal (now dead but at the time of wars "employed" by DB (our CIA))  famously said explaining why Balkan wars started:
"Swamp is too small and there is too many crocodiles".      
With no intention to save anyone let alone Yanukovych but it hurts my brain when they say " he enjoyed luxury while people earn 100 Euros a month". No one cares when Obama makes party and spends enormous amount of tax payers money and Americans that are lucky to still have job are working for $4/hour and have to work two jobs just to feed themselves even if they have university degrees (and loan to pay for it). Hypocrisy is nowhere worse then in western media...    

Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind...Albert Einstein
by vbo on Tue Feb 25th, 2014 at 09:28:09 PM EST
[ Parent ]
What we call corruption they call tradition.

"It is not necessary to have hope in order to persevere."
by ARGeezer (ARGeezer a in a circle eurotrib daught com) on Wed Feb 26th, 2014 at 01:43:48 AM EST
[ Parent ]
China Matters: Looks Like US Played Hardball in the Ukraine...and Against the EU

So, by a less-than-generous view, it might be suspected that the United States encouraged demonstrators to break the truce, with the expectation that violence would occur and Yanukovich's equivocal fat cat backers, such as Akhmetov, would jump ship because the US had already informed them that their assets in the West would be at risk under US and EU sanctions.
If this is the case, the EU perhaps has additional reason to feel sore and resentful at the US.  By blowing up the truce and the transition deal, Nuland got Yanukovich out and "Yats"--the preferred US proxy, Arseniy Yatsenyuk--in, but at the cost of terminally alienating the Ukraine's pro-Russian segment--a segment, it might be pointed out, was actually able to elect Yanukovich in a free and fair election a while back.

Interesting links to US threats against Ukrainian oligarchs in Yahoo! Sports of all places.

China Matters: Looks Like US Played Hardball in the Ukraine...and Against the EU


So, by a less-than-generous view, it might be suspected that the United States encouraged demonstrators to break the truce, with the expectation that violence would occur and Yanukovich's equivocal fat cat backers, such as Akhmetov, would jump ship because the US had already informed them that their assets in the West would be at risk under US and EU sanctions.
If this is the case, the EU perhaps has additional reason to feel sore and resentful at the US.  By blowing up the truce and the transition deal, Nuland got Yanukovich out and "Yats"--the preferred US proxy, Arseniy Yatsenyuk--in, but at the cost of terminally alienating the Ukraine's pro-Russian segment--a segment, it might be pointed out, was actually able to elect Yanukovich in a free and fair election a while back.


Sweden's finest (and perhaps only) collaborative, leftist e-newspaper Synapze.se
by A swedish kind of death on Tue Feb 25th, 2014 at 02:19:17 PM EST
Blockquote 2 is a repaste of blockquote 1...
by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Tue Feb 25th, 2014 at 02:34:44 PM EST
[ Parent ]
We need smarter Tribext...

Here we go:

Behind the scenes, football tycoon pulls strings in Ukraine crisis - Yahoo Sports

According to the influential news site Ukrainska Pravda, visiting US Assistant Secretary of State Victoria Nuland warned Akhmetov at a secret meeting when she visited Kiev in December that he and other wealthy backers of the Regions Party could face EU and US sanctions if the police used force against the protesters.

For a businessman with an international reputation and properties outside of Ukraine, including a luxury town house in London, this was clearly an unwelcome prospect.



Sweden's finest (and perhaps only) collaborative, leftist e-newspaper Synapze.se
by A swedish kind of death on Tue Feb 25th, 2014 at 03:21:20 PM EST
[ Parent ]
EU has all the reasons to worry. This is happening in their neighborhood and also there will be flood of new immigrants now from Ukraine all over the Europe...no matter what happens there.

Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind...Albert Einstein
by vbo on Tue Feb 25th, 2014 at 09:36:10 PM EST
[ Parent ]
also there will be flood of new immigrants now from Ukraine all over the Europe
Because we haven't had a "flood" of Ukrainian immigrants for two decades already...

A society committed to the notion that government is always bad will have bad government. And it doesn't have to be that way. — Paul Krugman
by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Wed Mar 5th, 2014 at 02:59:58 PM EST
[ Parent ]
Interesting links to US threats against Ukrainian oligarchs in Yahoo! Sports of all places.

Yahoo Sports has a reputation for being the best investigative journalism outlet in sports.  It's the only part of Yahoo that's worth a damn.

If you want to give a university athletic director a heart attack, just tell him Yahoo is poking around campus.

Be nice to America. Or we'll bring democracy to your country.

by Drew J Jones (pedobear@pennstatefootball.com) on Wed Mar 5th, 2014 at 02:51:09 PM EST
[ Parent ]
OK...another day...
00:13 GMT:

The Russian flag has been taken down in the Crimean city of Simferopol after being briefly erected by the protesters over the city's administration building, UNN reports. Yet protesters continue to call for a referendum on the status of Crimea and say the seizure of power in Kiev was illegal.

Protesters are demanding the restoration of the constitution of Crimea of 1992, according to which the region would have its own president and foreign policy. An extraordinary session of the Crimean parliament is scheduled for Wednesday.

...23:35 GMT:

Ukraine's Berkut riot police force has been disbanded, acting Interior Minister Arsen Avakov announced on his Facebook page. The details of the newly signed order will be announced on Wednesday.
(vbo:they do not expect any more riots I assume...well...at least not in a part of Ukraine where they can step)
...22:47 GMT:

A technical support group from the International Monetary Fund (IMF) might soon head to Ukraine, IMF chief Christine Lagarde said on Tuesday.

"We will probably shortly send some technical assistance support to the country," Lagarde said at Stanford University in California. "Because this is our duty to a member if that member asks for that. That is clearly what is likely to happen."
(vbo:yeah someone has to write down "economic reforms" for them , and fast...)
...21:02 GMT:

Additional members of the Marine Corps' new Security Augmentation Unit have been deployed for extra security measures at the US Embassy in Ukraine

"We have slightly augmented our existing Marine Security Guard force at the Embassy in Kyiv," Jen Psaki, State Department spokeswoman said Tuesday.

An official with the department told NBC news that nine Marines have been deployed to Kiev.
(vbo:why? Kiev is a friendly territory...it's not Crim...)
...19:51 GMT:

Protesters have raised a Russian flag on the Supreme Council building in the Ukrainian city of Simferopol. They have blocked the entrance to the Crimean parliament building.
...15:37 GMT:

Russia's Foreign Ministry says it will provide the EU and OSCE with video proof that extremists caused chaos and devastation in Kiev.

"We are deeply concerned by what is going on in Ukraine and, particularly, by how the West comments on the situation and tries to influence on it," the Ministry said in a statement in English on its Facebook page. "Western media prefers not to talk about the fact that the riots were organized by extremists. Perhaps the management of the European structures does not know how extremists, posing themselves as "civilians" acted." (vbo:they don't need to...everything is well documented on Youtube for those who want to see)



Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind...Albert Einstein
by vbo on Tue Feb 25th, 2014 at 10:50:04 PM EST
Photo's of Kiev Militia with Yellow Armbands Yep!

Global Warming - distance between America and Europe is steadily increasing.
by Oui on Wed Feb 26th, 2014 at 01:45:59 AM EST
[ Parent ]
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/feb/25/ukraine-separatism-threat-crimea-russia-naval-port

A visiting Russian parliamentarian said earlier on Tuesday that Moscow would act in the event of heightened tension over the Crimean peninsula.

"If the life and health of our compatriots is under threat, we will not stand to one side," the parliamentarian, Leonid Slutsky, said after arriving in the regional capital of Simferopol for a one-day visit.

Slutsky, who leads the Russian Duma's committee for relations with former Soviet states, declined to say what sort of action Russia might take.

AFP reported that two armoured personnel carriers were deployed near Russian military installations in Ukraine's second port of Sevastopol on Tuesday. One of the vehicles was on a base belonging to Russia's Black Sea fleet while another was parked in the courtyard of a navy building in the city centre. A spokesman for the fleet in Sevastopol refused to comment on the deployment of the vehicles but local media reported that they had been sent out in case of "terrorist attacks".



Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind...Albert Einstein
by vbo on Wed Feb 26th, 2014 at 01:35:51 AM EST
Does anyone have details on just why Khrushchev gave the Crimea to the Ukrainian Soviet Socialist Republic? The area had been historically Russian for centuries.

"It is not necessary to have hope in order to persevere."
by ARGeezer (ARGeezer a in a circle eurotrib daught com) on Wed Feb 26th, 2014 at 01:48:29 AM EST
History of Crimea - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Following the Russian Revolution of 1917, the military and political situation in Crimea was chaotic like that in much of Russia. During the ensuing Russian Civil War, Crimea changed hands numerous times and was for a time a stronghold of the anti-Bolshevik White Army. It was in Crimea that the White Russians led by General Wrangel made their last stand against Nestor Makhno and the Red Army in 1920. When resistance was crushed, many of the anti-Communist fighters and civilians escaped by ship to Istanbul. A 25-ruble banknote of the Crimean Regional Government

Crimea changed hands several times over the course of the conflict and several political entities were set up on the peninsula. These included:

At the end of WWII, the Crimean Tatars (a Turkic people of Muslim tradition) were massively deported to Central Asia on suspicion of collaboration with the German occupiers.

Following a link on that Wikipedia page leads to a 1954 article on a pro-Tatar site:

Transfer of the Crimea to the Ukraine

In the light of these facts, the transfer of the Crimea to the Ukraine takes on the significance of a carefully considered political step. The transfer of the Crimea to the Ukraine is in the interpretation of the Communist Party a gift of the "elder brother" to the "younger brother" on the occasion of the tricentennial of the unification of Russia and the Ukraine, as if to demonstrate the solicitude of the central government and its desire to meet the Ukrainian people halfway, at the same time reducing its gravitation toward independence from the Kremlin.

This transfer reveals the long term policy. The Ukraine, as the largest republic outside of the RSFSR, is quite understandably the republic with local sentiments which all the other republics listen to. It is the center in which, as it were, all the republics are united in their national aspirations. The Central Committee of the KPSU had in mind, as well, the idea of weakening the significance of the Ukraine as such a center when it ordered the Supreme Soviet to issue this decree. In the first place, the Ukraine, having received the Crimea, an area which in fact belongs to the Crimean Tatars, at the same time makes itself an empire to a certain degree, for now it possesses lands without justification based on ethnographic principles. Therefore, it is the Ukraine and not the RSFSR which turns up as a party to the dispute over the lands of the Crimean Tatars. This places all the republics of Central Asia--the whole Moslem world of the USSR--in opposition to the Ukraine.

Thus, nearly twenty-five million members of the USSR's Moslem world will no longer look on the Ukrainian SSR as their ally in the struggle against the Kremlin's imperialism, but on the contrary will look upon it as a republic with imperialist tendencies which, by virtue of these tendencies, should become an ally of the Kremlin.

I repeat, it's a pro-Tatar site that offers this explanation.

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Wed Feb 26th, 2014 at 02:50:06 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Krushchev "gave a present to himself"...that's what they say here. I assume he was Ukrainian?

Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind...Albert Einstein
by vbo on Wed Feb 26th, 2014 at 05:13:29 AM EST
[ Parent ]
http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/RUSkhrushchev.htm

Nikita Khrushchev, the grandson of a serf and the son of a coal miner, was born in Kalinovka, Ukraine on 5th April, 1894.


Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind...Albert Einstein
by vbo on Wed Feb 26th, 2014 at 05:16:57 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Even if his birthplace was in modern Ukraine was he Ukrainian or Russian? The article uses the spelling of his birthplace used for Russian cities, while the Ukrainian towns (there are several of them) are spelt Kalynivka.

In any case, Wikipedia puts his birthplace in the one in Kursk Oblast, on the Russian side of the border.

by gk (gk (gk quattro due due sette @gmail.com)) on Wed Feb 26th, 2014 at 05:24:35 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Even if his birthplace was in modern Ukraine was he Ukrainian or Russian?
--------
Well I wouldn't know that...

Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind...Albert Einstein
by vbo on Wed Feb 26th, 2014 at 05:27:27 AM EST
[ Parent ]
He did go on to live in what is now called Donetsk, joined the Ukrainian Communist Party, fought in the revolutionary wars in Ukraine against the Whites, rose in the Ukrainian CP...
by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Wed Feb 26th, 2014 at 05:30:44 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Donetsk - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Donetsk was founded in 1869 when the Welsh businessman John Hughes built a steel plant and several coal mines in the southern part of the Russian Empire at Aleksandrovka (Ukrainian: Олександрівка). The town initially was given the name Hughesovka (Yuzovka; Russian: Юзовка; Ukrainian: Юзівка).[4] By the beginning of the 20th century, Yuzovka had approximately 50,000 inhabitants,[5] and had attained the status of a city in 1917.[6] The main district of "Hughezovka" is named English Colony, and the British origin of the city is reflected in its layout and architecture.

Perhaps Khrushchev was Welsh.

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Wed Feb 26th, 2014 at 05:38:33 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Khrushchev had a significant cultural identity with the Ukraine. I recall from my Russian History professor that Stalin treated him almost as a court jester and Ukrainian specimen, but a loyal Communist Ukrainian and a shrewd one at that. I had not realized that the Tatar identity of the Crimea had remained so thoroughly intact until Stalin's time, though I was aware of Stalin's massive use of internal relocation of ethnic minorities for political purposes. One tell of the Tatar identity of the Crimea was the name of the Russian noble from whom John Hughes bought the land he used to create his Russian steel empire: Sergei Kochubey. The 'bey' is the tell. Co-option of local elites was a standard policy of Russia under the Romanovs.  

"It is not necessary to have hope in order to persevere."
by ARGeezer (ARGeezer a in a circle eurotrib daught com) on Wed Feb 26th, 2014 at 09:53:40 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Now I am checking USSR leaders and just found out that Leonid Brezhnev also was born in Ukraine.


Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind...Albert Einstein
by vbo on Wed Feb 26th, 2014 at 05:24:49 AM EST
[ Parent ]
If you read carefully, you'll see that it was not intended as a "gift" to Ukraine.
by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Wed Feb 26th, 2014 at 05:20:01 AM EST
[ Parent ]
http://rt.com/news/kiev-clashes-rioters-police-571/

08:40 GMT:

The special riot police force known as `Berkut' has been invited to join the ranks of the law enforcement officials in the city of Sevastopol, located on the Crimean Peninsula. It comes shortly after the force was disbanded by the interim government of Kiev, following the bloody clashes in the capital.

"These people have done their duty with dignity, have shown to be true men, and now are being thrown to the gang of nationalists by their own ex-bosses," the head of Sevastopol City administration Aleksey Chaly said, as quoted by the local ForPost media outlet.  



Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind...Albert Einstein
by vbo on Wed Feb 26th, 2014 at 04:56:55 AM EST
http://news.yahoo.com/facing-collapse-ukraine-costly-prize-west-010303463.html

Ukraine may well be the geopolitical prize nobody can afford to win.
"The real question now is how much of the burden of dealing with Ukraine is going to be European and how much the Europeans are going to be able to slough off onto the American taxpayer," said Wayne Merry, a scholar at the American Foreign Policy Council. Right now, he said, Ukraine is fairly low on Washington's list of priorities amid bigger problems in Syria, the Israeli-Palestinian peace process and nuclear negotiations with Iran.

Ukraine's acting finance minister, Yuri Kobolov, says the country needs $35 billion to cover this year and next. He is looking to Europe or the United States for help, hopefully within the next two weeks.
(vbo: two weeks, hahahaha, what an optimist) ...Jonathan Adelman, professor of international relations at the University of Denver, said he sees little chance of the Washington coming through at a time of budgetary difficulties, highlighted this week when Defense Secretary Chuck Hagel proposed to shrink the U.S. Army to its smallest size since the 1940s.

"There's going to be no enthusiasm here for the tens of billions of dollars it would take to bail Ukraine out," Adelman said.
...EU foreign policy chief Catherine Ashton said Tuesday that the EU and its member nations are ready to help bridge Ukraine's short-term financing needs until a new government can negotiate a full-fledged assistance package with the International Monetary Fund. She said it was important that Russia also help out.
(vbo: as I said Ashton is my girl ...I can't decide if she is stupid or just and ugly arrogant bitch...Russians to help? Helloouu...or they simply think that Russians are stupid...?)
... "An approach providing Ukraine with breathing room and time is more likely to create a favorable environment for a positive outcome from Ukraine's next stage. Such a policy would serve the interests of Russia, the EU and the United States."
(vbo: if it is not too late already it soon will be too late for positive outcome...at least for Ukrainians)

Merry said the Europeans may not have understood what they had unleashed by courting Ukraine.

"A lot of people in a lot of those capitals really --Berlin and Paris to name two -- think that the European Union got too far out in front of itself, didn't think through what it was doing, got involved in what was a zero-sum position with Russia," Merry said.



Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind...Albert Einstein
by vbo on Wed Feb 26th, 2014 at 06:01:57 AM EST
I'd just like to note that if any male on ET called anyone an "ugly and arrogant bitch" there would be an immediate uproar. I find the term very offensive.

It is rightly acknowledged that people of faith have no monopoly of virtue - Queen Elizabeth II
by eurogreen on Wed Feb 26th, 2014 at 06:10:28 AM EST
[ Parent ]
OK. Then just arrogant bitch ;)
All tho you must admit that she is ugly...
And yes males are not allowed to make comments like this about woman :(
And maybe civilized Europeans would not choose those words but I can be excused because I am a Serb ( and we are savages :(
Well you can expect Ozzies too to be a bit rood and bear in mind that I spent more then 20 years here, haha

Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind...Albert Einstein
by vbo on Wed Feb 26th, 2014 at 06:30:52 AM EST
[ Parent ]
No, "bitch" is not OK either. And I don't want to know if you think she's ugly.

Should we make allowances about your anti-woman language because you're a woman? I don't think so.

Maybe I should let you off the hook about the word "bitch" ... not because you are a Serb, but because you are an Aussie. Perhaps it's not considered impolite over there eh?

It is rightly acknowledged that people of faith have no monopoly of virtue - Queen Elizabeth II

by eurogreen on Wed Feb 26th, 2014 at 06:41:09 AM EST
[ Parent ]
The always intelligent "markets" think differently:
Emerging stocks fell on Monday as Chinese shares posted their biggest loss in seven weeks on worries about the property market, while Ukraine's debt insurance costs dropped sharply on expectations of western aid.
Anyone know what are the key dates when Ukraine needs the money?
by gk (gk (gk quattro due due sette @gmail.com)) on Wed Feb 26th, 2014 at 06:14:29 AM EST
[ Parent ]
10:47 GMT:

Crimean Tatars and supporters of pro-Russian organizations are trying to approach the building of the peninsula's parliament. All in all, there are up to 5,000 Tatars and 700 pro-Russian demonstrators gathered at the scene.


RT said something like there are clashes...my internet is slow so I couldn't see properly...

Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind...Albert Einstein
by vbo on Wed Feb 26th, 2014 at 06:20:58 AM EST
Found his linked on Naked Capitalism:


I think that the current situation is such that everyone is in terrible shock over what's happening.

The EU representatives are shocked most of all. They were playing at being skillful diplomats, who stooped to work with the barbarous dictator of a third-world country. He was supposed to quiver with anticipation over his handout, in the form of an EU-Ukraine Association Agreement, which would have allowed him to don the mantle of the great Euro-integrator and win the 2015 elections.

..

The Kremlin is in a bit of shock as well. They were carefully masterminding the situation, supporting the Donbass thugs, gradually ramping up their influence in Ukraine and buying up key stocks. They were methodically planning to annex half of Ukraine as a "voluntary incorporation." But then this idiot Yanukovych started giving them a hard time trying to extort money in return for joining the Customs Union, and then he made a series of mistakes leading to the current disaster--in the middle of the Winter Olympics in Sochi, no less!

Worth a read in full.

by generic on Wed Feb 26th, 2014 at 07:06:06 AM EST
Yeah , definitely scuffles between Tatars and pro Russians...Some bloody heads already...

http://img.rt.com/files/news/22/df/80/00/ukraine_480p.mp4?event=download

Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind...Albert Einstein

by vbo on Wed Feb 26th, 2014 at 07:38:34 AM EST

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gtsMCDOqDhw&feature=player_embedded

Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind...Albert Einstein

by vbo on Wed Feb 26th, 2014 at 07:54:40 AM EST
http://news.yahoo.com/ukraine-rival-groups-protest-divided-crimea-111216509.html

Interesting video...

Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind...Albert Einstein

by vbo on Wed Feb 26th, 2014 at 08:26:35 AM EST
A group of US financial experts have arrived in Kiev to consult the new government on "immediate economic reforms," Interfax-Ukraine reports, citing US Deputy Secretary of State William Burns.  

They do not need to worry...Americans are there...where ever they and their IMF come that country is simply flourishing...

Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind...Albert Einstein
by vbo on Wed Feb 26th, 2014 at 08:29:12 AM EST
Things are happening pretty fast...

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/ukraine/10662187/Ukraine-revolution-Protesters-in-s tand-off-in-pro-Russian-Crimea.html

Ukraine revolution: Putin puts troops on alert in western Russia
Moscow flexes military muscle with urgent drills amid confrontation between pro and anti-Russian protesters in Crimean capital

President Vladimir Putin has put armed forces in western Russia 'on alert', amid rising tensions in the pro-Russian Crimea over the overthrow of Viktor Yanukovich by pro-European protesters.

In a sign of Moscow's displeasure at the revolution in Kiev, Mr Putin ordered an urgent drill to test troops' combat readiness.

"In accordance with an order from the president of the Russian Federation, forces of the Western Military District were put on alert at 1400 (1000 GMT) today," Interfax quoted Sergei Shoigu, the Russian Defence Minister, as saying.  



Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind...Albert Einstein
by vbo on Wed Feb 26th, 2014 at 08:33:36 AM EST
13:39 GMT:

The UK is "taking note" of the activities of the Russian Armed Forces and opposes "external interference in Ukraine," Defense Secretary Philip Hammond was quoted as saying by Reuters.

Hammond's comments come as Russia is staging a surprise military drill.  


Huh are the things getting serious?Or that's just regular procedure in tensions like this? What do you say?

Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind...Albert Einstein
by vbo on Wed Feb 26th, 2014 at 08:57:08 AM EST
While we are waiting for development here is a list of candidates for presidency in Ukraine

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/ukraine/10661619/The-potential-candidates-competing -for-Ukraines-presidency.html

What do you think?

Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind...Albert Einstein

by vbo on Wed Feb 26th, 2014 at 08:59:53 AM EST
Here are our / western partners in Ukraine

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=XtxbGjkpkF8

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T3uB0PnCM8k&feature=player_embedded

PLUS

Turkey is ready to put a claim for the Crimea in case of division of Ukraine

http://nahnews.com.ua/turkey-is-ready-to-put-a-claim-for-the-crimea-in-case-of-division-of-ukraine/

Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind...Albert Einstein

by vbo on Wed Feb 26th, 2014 at 09:18:12 AM EST
First video:
http://nahnews.com.ua/category/topic-en/

The leader of Rovno Right Sector Alexandr Muzychko, known as Sashko Beliy, came to the meeting of the panel of the Rovno City Council with the Kalashnikov and knives.


Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind...Albert Einstein
by vbo on Wed Feb 26th, 2014 at 09:25:35 AM EST
[ Parent ]
14:21 GMT:

Moscow is urging Kiev to prevent further aggravation of the situation and to stop the country from descending into inter-religious confrontation.

"Russia is worried about non-stop excesses by radicals in Ukraine," the Russian Foreign Ministry said in a comment posted on its website. The radicals, who are confident in their "permissiveness and impunity," are continuing to impose their will and rules, the ministry said.

Following political destabilization, the "fragile peace" between religious confessions is now also under fire, Moscow said, adding that there has been an increasing number of threats against Ukrainian Orthodox Church clerics as well as attempts to seize Orthodox sacred places.

Such tendencies are "extremely dangerous" and may lead to "new upheavals and provoke an even deeper split of Ukrainian society," the Foreign Ministry said.  



Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind...Albert Einstein
by vbo on Wed Feb 26th, 2014 at 09:29:45 AM EST
Yanukovych car park: one car smashed, another car is missing (video)
25.02.2014 11:15   HIT, In Ukraine, incidents, Kiev, Politic, regions, Top news   No comments
AUDI_Museum_16

All collector cars in Yanukovych car park were signed - now, there is only a plate on the location of one of them. There are only three such cars in the world.

The most expensive $2,000,000 car disappears from Yanukovych car park.



Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind...Albert Einstein
by vbo on Wed Feb 26th, 2014 at 09:31:12 AM EST
Brzeziński: Ukrainian tycoons have to chip in a billion each to restore Ukraine
25.02.2014 10:17   Economics, HIT, In Ukraine, interview, Politic, Reform, Social policy, Top news, Ukraine, World   No comments
бжезинский

Civil War in Ukraine remains a possibility because of the position taken by the Crimea and eastern regions on Kiev events, writes Zbignev Brzeziński in The Financial Times. Brzezinski advises the West to prevent an "explosion of regional violence in Ukraine".
 



Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind...Albert Einstein
by vbo on Wed Feb 26th, 2014 at 09:34:01 AM EST
Ukraine has been raped, beheaded, dismembered. What's next? - English pravda.ru
Is a guarantee that there is no conspiracy against Ukraine between Germany, Poland and Russia? As a result of certain events going on in the country, the Crimean Peninsula would be handed over to the Russian Federation, the land that belonged to Poland before 1939 would be handed over to Warsaw, while Germany would take control of the west of Ukraine. These were the ideas expressed by retired colonel Alexander Musienko.

Alexander Musienko took part in combat actions in Afghanistan and Chechnya, events in Baku in 1990 and the civil war in Tajikistan in 1992-1993. He told Pravda.Ru that one could have avoided the civil war in Ukraine if the authorities had declared the state of emergency on time. "There would have been victims, 500, 1000, maybe even five thousand casualties. This would have been a terrible tragedy, but it would have prevented much greater sacrifices - dozens, maybe hundreds of thousands of people and the collapse of the state," said Musienko. According to him, the events in Kiev show that Ukraine has not been able to build a state machine in its new history, nor could it do that before, during the times of Bohdan Khmelnytsky, who had to seek assistance from the Russian tsar.

The spineless Ukrainian authorities had the spineless military, the expert said. They formed a generation of military leaders of low and medium level, who could not take responsibility for their actions. They can be prosecuted for executing orders, although it is the officials, who give orders that should be prosecuted.
by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Wed Feb 26th, 2014 at 09:45:00 AM EST
If there really is such a conspiracy, the Poles must be idiots. If the ex-Polish lands (with very few Poles left) are returned to Poland, that opens up the question of returning western Poland to Germany.....Crimea is different because they have a large Russian population, plus the Russian fleet.
by gk (gk (gk quattro due due sette @gmail.com)) on Wed Feb 26th, 2014 at 10:09:29 AM EST
[ Parent ]
RT: One reported dead and some are injured in Crimea...
There will be war...
PLUS
14:37 GMT:

Russia is taking steps to provide security for the Black Sea Fleet's facilities and arsenals, says Sergey Shoigu, Russia's Defense Minister.



Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind...Albert Einstein
by vbo on Wed Feb 26th, 2014 at 09:49:50 AM EST
Give us a link to this RT feed you are citing.
by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Wed Feb 26th, 2014 at 10:06:09 AM EST
[ Parent ]
BBC News - Ukraine crisis: Rival rallies of protesters in Crimea

Pro-Russian demonstrators clashed with Crimean Tatars and supporters of Ukraine's interim leaders in the city of Simferopol on Wednesday.

The pro-Moscow protesters gathered in front of parliament in the Crimean capital to protest against politicians in Kiev who are trying to form a new government.

One person died, probably from a heart attack, during the face-off.

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Thu Feb 27th, 2014 at 01:48:45 AM EST
[ Parent ]
NATO - News: Statement by NATO Defence Ministers on Ukraine, 26-Feb.-2014
A sovereign, independent and stable Ukraine, firmly committed to democracy and the rule of law, is key to Euro-Atlantic security. Consistent with the Charter on a Distinctive Partnership between NATO and Ukraine, NATO Allies will continue to support Ukrainian sovereignty and independence, territorial integrity, democratic development, and the principle of inviolability of frontiers, as key factors of stability and security in Central and Eastern Europe and on the continent as a whole.
by Katrin on Wed Feb 26th, 2014 at 11:25:22 AM EST
Another day...
RT:Armed people take over regional parliament in Crimea
Russian flag raised...

06:08 GMT:

The buildings of the Crimean parliament and administration have been seized by an unknown armed group.

Law enforcement authorities are stationed next to the Council of Ministers, with officers banning people from approaching the building, Interfax-Ukraine reported, citing the press service of the Crimean parliament.  


http://rt.com/news/kiev-clashes-rioters-police-571/


Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind...Albert Einstein
by vbo on Thu Feb 27th, 2014 at 01:20:44 AM EST
Armed men seize Crimea parliament - reports | World news | theguardian.com

Armed men have seized the regional government building and the parliament building in the Crimea region of Ukraine. the Interfax news agency reported.

It was not immediately clear who was in control of the buildings but a Reuters correspondent on the scene said the Russian flag was flying over both in the regional capital, Simferopol.

Ethnic Tatars who support Ukraine's new leaders and pro-Russia separatists had confronted each other outside the regional parliament on Wednesday.

Interfax quoted a local Tatar leader, Refat Chubarov, as saying on Facebook: "I have been told that the buildings of parliament and the council of ministers have been occupied by armed men in uniforms that do not bear any recognisable insignia."

"They have not yet made any demands," he said.

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Thu Feb 27th, 2014 at 01:53:54 AM EST
[ Parent ]
This one from the Guardian is a Reuters wire. Associated Press and Agence France Presse are wiring the same. The source is Interfax Ukraine and a Tatar Facebook page.

Wait and see.

by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Thu Feb 27th, 2014 at 02:01:21 AM EST
[ Parent ]
A local leader of the Tatar community in Ukraine's Crimea region says armed men have seized two government buildings in the regional capital, Simferopol.

Refat Chubarov wrote on his Facebook page early Thursday that the buildings of the local government and legislature were seized overnight by uniformed men.

Phone calls to the Crimean legislature are ringing unanswered, and its website is down. But the Interfax news agency reports that the legislature's press office has confirmed the building has been seized.

Fistfights broke out Wednesday outside the legislature's building in Simferopol between pro- and anti-Russian demonstrators.

In Kiev, opposition leaders who took charge after pro-Russian President Viktor Yanukovych fled were working on forming a new government to chart a path forward for the country and its ailing economy.



Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind...Albert Einstein
by vbo on Thu Feb 27th, 2014 at 01:39:14 AM EST
http://abcnews.go.com/International/wireStory/ukraine-disbands-police-unit-accused-violence-22676614

Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind...Albert Einstein
by vbo on Thu Feb 27th, 2014 at 01:39:37 AM EST
[ Parent ]
08:35 GMT:

The Crimean parliament building has been seized by an armed group calling itself "Self-defense of the Russian-speaking population of Crimea." The group has said it will only allow legitimate MPs and the speaker of the parliament into the building, Russia-24 TV reports.
...08:37 GMT:

Crimean Premier Anatoly Mogilev has given his contact number to the unknown armed group which seized the parliament's building.
...08:38 GMT:

Ukraine's acting President Aleksandr Turchinov has warned Russia against "military aggression" in Crimea. He stressed that Russian troop movements around the Black Sea Fleet's base in Sevastopol, Crimea, would be seen by Ukraine as act of aggression.
...08:41 GMT:

Russia's Foreign Ministry has said that "large-scale human rights violations," as well as attacks and vandalism are major causes for concern.
...08:41 GMT:

The representatives of the unknown armed group that seized the Crimean administration buildings have informed the region's PM Anatoly Mogilev that they are not authorized to conduct negotiations.
...08:41 GMT:

The center of the city of Simferopol has been closed to traffic, as police widened the security perimeter around the administration buildings.



Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind...Albert Einstein
by vbo on Thu Feb 27th, 2014 at 03:57:36 AM EST
The Vineyard of the Saker: The geopolitics of the Ukrainian conflict: back to basics
Having rapidly looked at the locals, let us now turn to the folks that do matter:

The Ukrainian oligarchs:

Most of them believe that as long as the Ukraine maintains an anti-Russian stance the EU will let them do whatever the hell they want inside the Ukraine.  They are correct.  For them, signing an otherwise meaningless agreement with the EU is basically accepting the following deal: they become the faithful servants of their EU overlords in exchange for what the EU overlords will let them continue to pillage the Ukraine in pretty much any way they want.

There is a smaller group of oligarchs who still stands to lose more than win if the Russian-Ukrainian relations sour and if Russia introduces barriers to trade with the Ukraine (which Russia would have to do if the Ukraine signs an free trade agreement with the EU).  These oligarchs believe that more money can be made from Russia than form the EU and they are the folks who convinced Yanukovich to make his infamous "zag" from the EU towards Russia.  Thus, there is a split inside the Ukrainian oligarchy whose representatives can be found on both sides of the current struggle.

The EU:

The EU is in a deep, systemic, economic, social and political crisis and it is absolutely desperate for new opportunities to rescue itself from its slow-motion collapse.  For the EU, the Ukraine is first and foremost a market to sells is goods and services.  The Ukraine is also a way to make the EU look bigger, more powerful, more relevant.  Some believe that the Ukraine can also provide cheap labor for the EU, but I don't believe that this is a major consideration for the following reasons: the EU already has way too many immigrants, and the there has already been a steady stream of Ukrainians (and Balts) leaving their country for a better life in the West.  Thus, what the EU really wants is a way to benefit from the Ukraine but without suffering too many negative consequences from any agreement.  Hence the 1500 pages of the proposed agreement with the EU.

The USA:

The goals of the USA in the Ukraine are completely different from the goals of the EU, hence the very real tensions between their diplomats so well expressed by the "fuck the EU!" of Madam Nuland.  Furthermore, and unlike the bankrupt EU, the US has spent over 5'000'000'000 dollars to achieve its goals in the Ukraine.  But so what are these goals really?

This is were it gets really interesting.

First, we have to go back to the crucial statement made by Hillary Clinton in early December of 2012:
"There is a move to re-Sovietise the region," (...) "It's not going to be called that. It's going to be called a customs union, it will be called Eurasian Union and all of that,"   (...) "But let's make no mistake about it. We know what the goal is and we are trying to figure out effective ways to slow down or prevent it."
Now, it is absolutely irrelevant to argue about whether Hillary was right or wrong in her interpretation of what the Eurasian Union is supposed to become, what matters is that she, and her political masters, believe, and they really believe is that Putin wants to re-create the Soviet Union.  No matter how stupid this notion is, we have to always keep in mind that this is what the likes of Hillary sincerely believe.


'The history of public debt is full of irony. It rarely follows our ideas of order and justice.' Thomas Piketty
by melo (melometa4(at)gmail.com) on Thu Feb 27th, 2014 at 04:07:48 AM EST
09:02 GMT:

The Ukrainian parliament has begun a session which is set to see the coalition government confirmed. Acting President Aleksandr Turchinov is leading the session.


RT said that Ukraine "security forces" are on alert.
What forces? Is he is going to do the same thing ( mistake) as Yanukovych?


Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind...Albert Einstein
by vbo on Thu Feb 27th, 2014 at 04:22:33 AM EST
09:53 GMT:

Entertainment facilities and restaurants are shutting down in Simferopol, various managers informed on social networks, according to the Crimean news agency. Schools are closing in the city as well.  


My husband found on some pro Russian sites videos how they already made concrete barricades on the border of Crime republic and they are preparing themselves for the conflict (probably with those "security forces" that they are planing to sand from Kiev). It doesn't look good at all...  

Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind...Albert Einstein
by vbo on Thu Feb 27th, 2014 at 05:21:04 AM EST
RT just said that Yanukovych  is in Russia and he just gave a statment that he is still legitimate president of Ukraine and bla bla bla.
Not written news on RT yet...

Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind...Albert Einstein
by vbo on Thu Feb 27th, 2014 at 05:35:24 AM EST
http://www.theguardian.com/world/video/2014/feb/27/ukraine-crimea-government-video-reaction
Watch this video I can't post it directly
Vitali Klitschko, the former heavyweight boxing world champion who has announced that he will stand for the Ukrainian presidency, tells the people of Crimea...bla bla bla.

His guaranties are not worth anything as we already saw...


Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind...Albert Einstein
by vbo on Thu Feb 27th, 2014 at 05:50:59 AM EST

    10.43am GMT

Viktor Yanukovych is quoted by Russian media as saying:

    I, Viktor Fedorovich Yanukovych appeal to the people of Ukraine. As before I still consider myself to be the lawful head of the Ukrainian state, chosen freely by the will of the Ukrainian people.

    Now it is becoming clear that the people in south-eastern Ukraine and in Crimea do not accept the power vacuum and complete lawlessness in the country, when the heads of ministries are appointed by the mob.

    On the streets of many cities of our country there is an orgy of extremism ...I have to ask the Russian authorities to provide me with personal safety from the actions of extremists.

10.41am GMT

Ousted president Viktor Yanukovych has also asked Russia to protect him from "extremists" in his statement. His whereabouts at present are unclear. At least one Russian news organisation has reported that he is in Moscow.
 



Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind...Albert Einstein
by vbo on Thu Feb 27th, 2014 at 05:53:48 AM EST
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/feb/27/ukraine-pro-russian-gunmen-seize-crimea-parliament-live -updates

Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind...Albert Einstein
by vbo on Thu Feb 27th, 2014 at 05:54:10 AM EST
[ Parent ]
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/feb/27/ukraine-pro-russian-gunmen-seize-crimea-parliament-live -updates

10.57am GMT

A Russian official has been quoted as saying that Moscow has accepted the plea of the fugitive ousted Ukrainian president, Viktor Yanukovych, who had asked for protection, AP reports.

Three Russia news agencies quoted an unnamed official saying that Yanukovych's request for protection "was satisfied on the territory of Russia".

It has been reported that he is in Moscow.



Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind...Albert Einstein
by vbo on Thu Feb 27th, 2014 at 06:01:34 AM EST
Here this women representative Svobode for region of Lviv (stronghold of fascists)and supposed education minister in new revolutionary government is talking to children (2010)asking them for their names and explaining how for example the boy with name Misha (Russian name) if he lives in France he should change his name in to Mishel and according to that he needs to change his name in to Ukrainian version.Asking one of the girls for her name and the girl said Alena this woman told her that she should pack and go to Moscow.
What can I say...we on Balkan are actually so civilized comparing to these fascists...No wonder Russians are putting barricades

http://korrespondent.net/ukraine/1049820    

Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind...Albert Einstein

by vbo on Thu Feb 27th, 2014 at 06:53:33 AM EST
Russians of course cannot be fascist thugs. This is very reassuring.  
by afew (afew(a in a circle)eurotrib_dot_com) on Thu Feb 27th, 2014 at 07:10:53 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Of course they can...they have a bunch of lunatics and fascist too (like France) but they are not in real power...

Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind...Albert Einstein
by vbo on Thu Feb 27th, 2014 at 07:18:05 AM EST
[ Parent ]
Of course not. Same way as Israelis can't be Nazis.
by gk (gk (gk quattro due due sette @gmail.com)) on Thu Feb 27th, 2014 at 07:32:55 AM EST
[ Parent ]
11:30 GMT:

The European Parliament has called on Ukrainian's interim government to protect the country's Russian-speaking minority's right to use the language.

"All Ukrainian and international, political forces must work together to ensure a united Ukraine, taking into account linguistic, cultural and historical factors," said the parliamentary statement.  


Isn't it a bit too late guys?

Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind...Albert Einstein
by vbo on Thu Feb 27th, 2014 at 07:15:24 AM EST
One of the first decisions of the opposition-controlled parliament was to revoke the recognition of Russian, Hungarian and Romanian as "regional languages".

This is possibly a violation of the Council of Europe's Charter on regional and minority languages.

A society committed to the notion that government is always bad will have bad government. And it doesn't have to be that way. — Paul Krugman

by Migeru (migeru at eurotrib dot com) on Thu Feb 27th, 2014 at 07:19:57 AM EST
[ Parent ]
The EP has no real power over foreign affairs, in particular as the member states has their own foreign policies anyway.

Sweden's finest (and perhaps only) collaborative, leftist e-newspaper Synapze.se
by A swedish kind of death on Thu Feb 27th, 2014 at 08:25:58 AM EST
[ Parent ]


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